Alina Phoenix said:

Jaywalker SC said:

I find it interesting that Plarium seems to always get the blame for the actions of those persons in real power in the game.

I blame Plarium for one thing only: massive zombie armies that do not eat a thing yet can kill, and do not die of hunger. It goes against the natural way of life and war that this game is based on. 

This is not "Walking Dead" season 205.

Yet the decision to engage in a server war to destroy everyone's beacons and fortresses - no matter the level - was not of Plarium's doing but that of a very small number of people who threw old friendships, diplomacy &  common sense out the window without a miniscule thought to tomorrow.

And that with just with the total self-serving aim of being in top 10 at all costs. Sad really.

Hello.

Before removing the feature that Units die if the food balance is negative, we received a lot of complaints about it and suggestions to have it removed from the game. 

We received such requests not only from players who were using the in-game purchases but from the players who built their Army with Resources spending their time and effort. That's why it was decided to stop killing Units if you run out of food.

Hello Alina,

Thank you for taking the time to reply. 

I know this is a controversial issue. However, you may have noticed it is one that is getting MUCH more attention lately. Whatever the reasoning behind the original decision, this will need to be addressed by Plarium one way or another as it is utterly nonsensical at present. 

I have been one of those who had tens of thousands of Silent Ones and misc Def gobbling up more food that I could ever produce. That is till Frenzie, Azog, Big Kahuna and co. turned them into dust in Eberron & KT beacons thrice at least. (They know I hold no grudges.)

When I was in zero food, I felt there were not enough opportunities to get affordable boosts. Thats the real issue.

In my personal opinion - yet I hesitate to speak for the MANY others that have voiced similar facts - armies that do not need to eat, makes ZERO common sense. 

Complaints about the ratio between off/def stats are not the issue. I honestly can see the balance. Castle def makes sense. So much on Stormfalll makes sense except this one point.

It isnt happening according to how nature works. Except if you are a Walking Dead fan. 

Jay

PS: Those who know me are aware I am a defensive player, period.

You can't blame the players. That is ultimately very naive.

I get why you are and I have been down that route of thought myself at times but....

The business model for this game and the development of pretty much all the content, is around maintaining a small players base and catching whales. Everything that Plarium do is based around extracting top dollar from a handful of players.

To then blame those players for the breakdown in the game is missing the point. To use the often used phrase "everything is working as intended". This is exactly how Plarium set up and envisage the game working. People are just following the Plarium plan.

The direction of the game isn't some random one chosen by the players. This is carefully crafted business model, not just followed by Plarium but widespread in the industry. It's crafted with deep knowledge of human psychology and how to subtly manipulate and exploit people's base urges and impulses. It's not an accident is completely by design. It's not about making great games it's about exploiting flaws in human nature to make easy money.

Given all that, when some people behave exactly and as predicted and expected, following the path explicitly designed to capture them by the developers, it's a bit rich that you expect to blame the players that fell for it and not the people built the system.

Yes those players should feel some responsibility for breaking the game. Yes in a perfect world they would consider their impact on the game, the wider game community and all those around them and realise they are ruining the experience for everyone else. But most of them probably didn't because they were following their own urges and impulses, sometimes for no better reason than "they could" and they felt like it. But don't forget Plarium designed the system so "they could" andi intentionally build the whole game and business model around the fact that "they would". 

So without a shadow of a doubt the responsibility sits first and foremost with Plarium.

And on a final note, not all game are so blatant pay to win as this series we play. 

If you play other MMO's you will know that there are a variety of less aggressive but successful business models that support the games themselves and the players in a much more symbiotic approach which nutures both the player experience/quality of the game with long term profitability for the developer. 

The only way to "make a buck" isn't the model Plarium chose, they weren't forced down this route as the only way to earn a crust, this was a definite conscious choice. Plarium willfully decided to sacrifice game balance and the long term future of the games for maximising short term profit.

Jaywalker SC said:

Alina Phoenix said:

Jaywalker SC said:

I find it interesting that Plarium seems to always get the blame for the actions of those persons in real power in the game.

I blame Plarium for one thing only: massive zombie armies that do not eat a thing yet can kill, and do not die of hunger. It goes against the natural way of life and war that this game is based on. 

This is not "Walking Dead" season 205.

Yet the decision to engage in a server war to destroy everyone's beacons and fortresses - no matter the level - was not of Plarium's doing but that of a very small number of people who threw old friendships, diplomacy &  common sense out the window without a miniscule thought to tomorrow.

And that with just with the total self-serving aim of being in top 10 at all costs. Sad really.

Hello.

Before removing the feature that Units die if the food balance is negative, we received a lot of complaints about it and suggestions to have it removed from the game. 

We received such requests not only from players who were using the in-game purchases but from the players who built their Army with Resources spending their time and effort. That's why it was decided to stop killing Units if you run out of food.

Hello Alina,

Thank you for taking the time to reply. 

I know this is a controversial issue. However, you may have noticed it is one that is getting MUCH more attention lately. Whatever the reasoning behind the original decision, this will need to be addressed by Plarium one way or another as it is utterly nonsensical at present. 

I have been one of those who had tens of thousands of Silent Ones and misc Def gobbling up more food that I could ever produce. That is till Frenzie, Azog, Big Kahuna and co. turned them into dust in Eberron & KT beacons thrice at least. (They know I hold no grudges.)

When I was in zero food, I felt there were not enough opportunities to get affordable boosts. Thats the real issue.

In my personal opinion - yet I hesitate to speak for the MANY others that have voiced similar facts - armies that do not need to eat, makes ZERO common sense. 

Complaints about the ratio between off/def stats are not the issue. I honestly can see the balance. Castle def makes sense. So much on Stormfalll makes sense except this one point.

It isnt happening according to how nature works. Except if you are a Walking Dead fan. 

Jay

PS: Those who know me are aware I am a defensive player, period.

Hello!

I'm sorry for the delayed reply. I guess this question was more discussed recently as some players think that this limit was removed only in advantage for players who are using the in-game purchases. But it's not and as I said in one of my previous replies, removing this limit allows all players to create a big army without being concerned of the fact that it can be dismissed if the Food is negative.

djmoody said:

You can't blame the players. That is ultimately very naive.

I get why you are and I have been down that route of thought myself at times but....

The business model for this game and the development of pretty much all the content, is around maintaining a small players base and catching whales. Everything that Plarium do is based around extracting top dollar from a handful of players.

To then blame those players for the breakdown in the game is missing the point. To use the often used phrase "everything is working as intended". This is exactly how Plarium set up and envisage the game working. People are just following the Plarium plan.

The direction of the game isn't some random one chosen by the players. This is carefully crafted business model, not just followed by Plarium but widespread in the industry. It's crafted with deep knowledge of human psychology and how to subtly manipulate and exploit people's base urges and impulses. It's not an accident is completely by design. It's not about making great games it's about exploiting flaws in human nature to make easy money.

Given all that, when some people behave exactly and as predicted and expected, following the path explicitly designed to capture them by the developers, it's a bit rich that you expect to blame the players that fell for it and not the people built the system.

Yes those players should feel some responsibility for breaking the game. Yes in a perfect world they would consider their impact on the game, the wider game community and all those around them and realise they are ruining the experience for everyone else. But most of them probably didn't because they were following their own urges and impulses, sometimes for no better reason than "they could" and they felt like it. But don't forget Plarium designed the system so "they could" andi intentionally build the whole game and business model around the fact that "they would". 

So without a shadow of a doubt the responsibility sits first and foremost with Plarium.

And on a final note, not all game are so blatant pay to win as this series we play. 

If you play other MMO's you will know that there are a variety of less aggressive but successful business models that support the games themselves and the players in a much more symbiotic approach which nutures both the player experience/quality of the game with long term profitability for the developer. 

The only way to "make a buck" isn't the model Plarium chose, they weren't forced down this route as the only way to earn a crust, this was a definite conscious choice. Plarium willfully decided to sacrifice game balance and the long term future of the games for maximising short term profit.

Just a side note:  I've found games that make Stormfall look good by comparison.  I won't name names since I don't want the thread deleted, but a few mobile "strategy" games are such blatant cash grabs that to even get the building to make the troops, you have to spend real money; it is not attainable at all just from gameplay, even though the game is advertized as free to play.

Any "noob" joining the game who see's a raid report from the coiners are not very likely to log in again.  Where is Plarium's future revenue going to come from?  I have been reading forums for the past couple of days and the same themes are addressed over and over again.  The replys from moderators etc seems to be "if you don't like it then sod off".

Filler said:

Any "noob" joining the game who see's a raid report from the coiners are not very likely to log in again.  Where is Plarium's future revenue going to come from?  I have been reading forums for the past couple of days and the same themes are addressed over and over again.  The replys from moderators etc seems to be "if you don't like it then sod off".

Just wanted to add my voice.  I hope Plarium will listen to the many instead of the few.

Hello!

Welcome to the Forum and thanks for sharing your thoughts here.

First and the main rule that will help any new player is to join a good League. In this case, the members of the League will send reinforcements to the Castle of the new player and help to understand the game faster and faster develop the Castle.

Thanks for the example of "sod off" - join a "good" league, not one of those non-coining losers?

As a non-coining loser league we actively recruit "noobs" and try to help the grow and understand the game.   The problem being all they see is forums full of the same complaints about massive imbalances of troop numbers, alts and unobtainable achievements.  It is the little leagues who grow the "noobs" not the big ones.  They simply poach the coiners and take the beacons away from the little guys, therefore stopping us from becoming "good" leagues.

If you chose to reply, please consider what i am trying to say and acknowledge whether i am wright or wrong.  I do not wish to see this game die, however without the "noobs" how long before the coiners get sick and leave?

Filler said:

Thanks for the example of "sod off" - join a "good" league, not one of those non-coining losers?

As a non-coining loser league we actively recruit "noobs" and try to help the grow and understand the game.   The problem being all they see is forums full of the same complaints about massive imbalances of troop numbers, alts and unobtainable achievements.  It is the little leagues who grow the "noobs" not the big ones.  They simply poach the coiners and take the beacons away from the little guys, therefore stopping us from becoming "good" leagues.

Maybe i am wrong and the "good" leagues who are completely full of coiners and their alts are actually recruiting the "noobs" to their 100% full leagues and training them in the gameplay?

If you chose to reply, please consider what i am trying to say and acknowledge whether i am wright or wrong.  I do not wish to see this game die, however without the "noobs" how long before the coiners get sick and leave?

To be fair, she said "good" and qualified it with sending reinforcements and showing new guys the way the game works.  Considering its mostly the little guys willing to take in low level castles (while many of the tops either reject them for being too weak or for fear they are alts), then doesn't that mean that the little guys and the academy's are the "good" leagues?

Thank you Thatguy, i feel your agreeing with me but would be nice for a moderator to acknowledge that the little league (non-coiners, as is the point of this thread) as the ones training the noobs because the big leagues cant/wont train them.

As a little league we could take in "noobs" give them help and advice and they could use DE from our beacon to lower food intake to make troops productions a little easier.  That was our best insentive for them.  Now we lost our  beacon our little league is even less attractive to "noobs", it looks very unlikely we will ever be able to offer them access to beacon benefits again.

With the colossal armies now available my entire league combined is unable to protect a "noob" from a raid.  Put yourself in the position of a new player.  You join a small league build a few troops take some advice from you league-mates, and grow a little.  You then see beacons and say, why cant we get one of those?  After we explain getting one is easy holding it is impossible they inevitable feel they joined a weak/loser league.  So they want to leave and join a big league, however the big league doesn't trust/want them.  So the new player say's thank but keep your game and quit.  Again where is Plarium's future revenue, even your big coiners will one day leave, therefore R I P Stormfall.

Please listen to the many not just the few big coiners.

Filler said:

Thank you Thatguy, i feel your agreeing with me but would be nice for a moderator to acknowledge that the little league (non-coiners, as is the point of this thread) as the ones training the noobs because the big leagues cant/wont train them.

As a little league we could take in "noobs" give them help and advice and they could use DE from our beacon to lower food intake to make troops productions a little easier.  That was our best insentive for them.  Now we lost our  beacon our little league is even less attractive to "noobs", it looks very unlikely we will ever be able to offer them access to beacon benefits again.

With the colossal armies now available my entire league combined is unable to protect a "noob" from a raid.  Put yourself in the position of a new player.  You join a small league build a few troops take some advice from you league-mates, and grow a little.  You then see beacons and say, why cant we get one of those?  After we explain getting one is easy holding it is impossible they inevitable feel they joined a weak/loser league.  So they want to leave and join a big league, however the big league doesn't trust/want them.  So the new player say's thank but keep your game and quit.  Again where is Plarium's future revenue, even your big coiners will one day leave, therefore R I P Stormfall.

Please listen to the many not just the few big coiners.

well

KT has KT2 for training

EMPs had unf Gods

Dominus has Dom imp

FoH has GoH

Rebels has Reb Light B

Destiny had D2 then D.

KoK had KoK 2, KoK 3(KoK E), etc

Fellowship has {{F}}

etc

so Big leagues do train little players, if they were in the main league they would be the first player hit in a war ... give credit to where credit is due

also DE for new players dont make a difference mainly if they a non-coiner

other then that you make a good point small players are not safe no matter where they are, just keep your league away from trouble and make sure alts manipulate your league into a war .... a common practice but people fall for it often funny thing is there own allies will set them up ! 

I tried to give credit to what you said, therefore i checked out some of the leagues you mentioned.

KT2, smallest player is lvl 40 from April this year and looked like an alt, after that the rest are lv60+.  Therefore no noobs there.

Could not find gods

Dom Imp, smallest player lvl 45 from July then lvl 60+.  Again no noobs.

Could not find GoH

Reb Light.  Newsest player lvl17, then all 60+.  Congrats i noob from 3 training leagues.

Got tired looking (sorry)

Try it yourself pick one of your training leagues and find some noobs.  We activly recruit new players sometimes 10 per day (few last, but thats normal).

As for DE, yes very little difference however when your a noob and you have no food production to be able to reduce the amount they eat is a real bonus.  Remember way back when you were new and you were always in negative and could not build?  Yes small  peanuts, but a little insentive for these people to keep playing.

As for keeping the noobs away from the big leagues.  We do that, they join we say dont hit "high" level players, dont hit players from "high" level leagues dont hit fortresses, beacons and hamlets.  Apart from that have fun???

Come on King, get off the fence.  The game has gone wrong.  Plarium need to address this.

Feel free to reply King, however i would prefer to hear from a moderator.  Maybe i am completely wrong and game is fine, but just read these boards the majority cant be that wrong can they?

Keep in mind that there are tons of leagues and the game's recommendation tool is fairly random.  Only a fraction of new players actually make it to any of the academy leagues, and of the ones that do, most quit by the time they hit level 50.

Generally, the biggest driver to quitting is when they take a huge loss, look at how long it'll take to rebuild, and decide to walk away.  

I have been picked up on my use of "noob" - to clarify what i mean by noob is a player who has been playing for hous/days.  Again my league actively recruits "new players".  What i mean by that is we follow new bubbles as the begin on the map and send invites so the random allocator does not apply to the point i was trying to make and put to the so far silent Moderators.

I hope im making sense, we get 10ish new players per day, maybe 1 will actually be playing and use chat.  This is where the problems come when we tell them not to bother using most of the features of the game because they are unobtainable.  This makes the game look rubbish to and new players.

Filler said:

I tried to give credit to what you said, therefore i checked out some of the leagues you mentioned.

KT2, smallest player is lvl 40 from April this year and looked like an alt, after that the rest are lv60+.  Therefore no noobs there.

Could not find gods

Dom Imp, smallest player lvl 45 from July then lvl 60+.  Again no noobs.

Could not find GoH

Reb Light.  Newsest player lvl17, then all 60+.  Congrats i noob from 3 training leagues.

Got tired looking (sorry)

Try it yourself pick one of your training leagues and find some noobs.  We activly recruit new players sometimes 10 per day (few last, but thats normal).

As for DE, yes very little difference however when your a noob and you have no food production to be able to reduce the amount they eat is a real bonus.  Remember way back when you were new and you were always in negative and could not build?  Yes small  peanuts, but a little insentive for these people to keep playing.

As for keeping the noobs away from the big leagues.  We do that, they join we say dont hit "high" level players, dont hit players from "high" level leagues dont hit fortresses, beacons and hamlets.  Apart from that have fun???

Come on King, get off the fence.  The game has gone wrong.  Plarium need to address this.

Feel free to reply King, however i would prefer to hear from a moderator.  Maybe i am completely wrong and game is fine, but just read these boards the majority cant be that wrong can they?

wow lol didnt expect you to go looking i would have named them more accurately as well as gave you other options

KT has a few sub leagues like KT2, KT 4 (NOT Former blues) as well as KT 5 and Templar Assassins (im sure you will find noobs somewhere in there)

GoH =Guardians of Honor as well as VoH = Vision of Honor ..... this is why i said big leagues train small players ... they are with my league and solo purpose is to train you dont believe me join up there with an alt and find out for yourself :)

Gods = unforgiving Gods

F2= {{F}}  =  {{Fellowship}}

most important point though again main reason i talk about it is cause of GoH, these leagues dont keep inactive they cast them out once they go over 3 days ...... and since new players dont always join this server there are 2 others wellllllll ..... much less players that are noobs and not alts end up here .... last year GoH had on average 30+ new players a week .... now they see at least 5

however you slice it in the end these sub leagues have been created for a reason and training was its goal feel free to mail any of those marshals and find out.

the underlining problem is most players are sent to server 2 and server 3 ..... if we just had 1 server things would be more active and more interesting indeed ...... heck here is the problem and solution right here

Filler said:

Thanks for the example of "sod off" - join a "good" league, not one of those non-coining losers?

As a non-coining loser league we actively recruit "noobs" and try to help the grow and understand the game.   The problem being all they see is forums full of the same complaints about massive imbalances of troop numbers, alts and unobtainable achievements.  It is the little leagues who grow the "noobs" not the big ones.  They simply poach the coiners and take the beacons away from the little guys, therefore stopping us from becoming "good" leagues.

Maybe i am wrong and the "good" leagues who are completely full of coiners and their alts are actually recruiting the "noobs" to their 100% full leagues and training them in the gameplay?

If you chose to reply, please consider what i am trying to say and acknowledge whether i am wright or wrong.  I do not wish to see this game die, however without the "noobs" how long before the coiners get sick and leave?

Hello!

Did I say that a good League means the League which consists of the players who use the in-game purchases only?

I don't think so. Good League for me = active League. Active League will help new player to learn the game. I don't think that the number of your in-game purchases influence whether you can learn a new player or not. You don't need to spend anything except for your time for it.

I guess when a new player joins the active League where he sees the support and help from his League members, he will help in fights against "League full of coiners".

My league is not a good league because we cannot hold a beacon, cannot raise and hold our fortress level, cannot defend any player from an attack from one of the "in-game purchasers" aka "coiners, cannot meet daily and weekly quests to give rewards for the entire league, cannot etc etc etc - where is the fun in this?

My league is a good league because we actively seek out and recruit new players (sometimes 10 per day), give as many free scrolls and supplies as possible to the "noobs", offer advice on tactics on game-play.  However the advice we give is don't hit big players or big leagues, hamlets or beacons in fact only raid inactive castles for supplies - again where is the fun in this?

The current set up of the game is so restrictive for the little guy.  There is no future for the game if the advice for "noobs" is ignore 75% of the in-game features because you will lose all your troops. and take weeks/months to grow them back.  However you could always reach for your credit card or re-mortgage your house and spend, spend, spend.

Filler said:

My league is not a good league because we cannot hold a beacon, cannot raise and hold our fortress level, cannot defend any player from an attack from one of the "in-game purchasers" aka "coiners, cannot meet daily and weekly quests to give rewards for the entire league, cannot etc etc etc - where is the fun in this?

My league is a good league because we actively seek out and recruit new players (sometimes 10 per day), give as many free scrolls and supplies as possible to the "noobs", offer advice on tactics on game-play.  However the advice we give is don't hit big players or big leagues, hamlets or beacons in fact only raid inactive castles for supplies - again where is the fun in this?

The current set up of the game is so restrictive for the little guy.  There is no future for the game if the advice for "noobs" is ignore 75% of the in-game features because you will lose all your troops. and take weeks/months to grow them back.  However you could always reach for your credit card or re-mortgage your house and spend, spend, spend.

I know Plarium is a business and and needs to make money, but i cant see how the game will survive without the "noobs".

That is the core problem with the game for players at all levels.  If you are not one of the huge spenders, then every time you actually play the way Plarium wants us and encourages us to play, you risk taking a big loss from which you cannot recover.  Plarium's claim is that this is what makes the game hard core.  That would be true except that its only hard core for those who don't buy it all back.  

To be fair, it is impossible to permanently lose the game.  A siege you can't break also protects you from being raided.  Strangely enough, when under siege, players are still able to spy, raid, etc normally.  I guess our troops are all ninjas, no wonder they take so long to train!  

Alina Phoenix said:

Filler said:

Thanks for the example of "sod off" - join a "good" league, not one of those non-coining losers?

As a non-coining loser league we actively recruit "noobs" and try to help the grow and understand the game.   The problem being all they see is forums full of the same complaints about massive imbalances of troop numbers, alts and unobtainable achievements.  It is the little leagues who grow the "noobs" not the big ones.  They simply poach the coiners and take the beacons away from the little guys, therefore stopping us from becoming "good" leagues.

Maybe i am wrong and the "good" leagues who are completely full of coiners and their alts are actually recruiting the "noobs" to their 100% full leagues and training them in the gameplay?

If you chose to reply, please consider what i am trying to say and acknowledge whether i am wright or wrong.  I do not wish to see this game die, however without the "noobs" how long before the coiners get sick and leave?

Hello!

Did I say that a good League means the League which consists of the players who use the in-game purchases only?

I don't think so. Good League for me = active League. Active League will help new player to learn the game. I don't think that the number of your in-game purchases influence whether you can learn a new player or not. You don't need to spend anything except for your time for it.

I guess when a new player joins the active League where he sees the support and help from his League members, he will help in fights against "League full of coiners".

That's great that you're recruiting new players and help them to grow and understand the game. In this way, you increase the power of your League as well.

Maybe if you did play the actual game with the rest of us, you would get another view of things. What do you think happens if a league of more modest and none coiners take a fight with one that does coin a lot? One side will run out of units fast where the other will just keep swarm like a locus because they can afford to. Maybe you get a few victories here and there, but at what cost? Its not like you can hold beacons and such in that scenario. 

It doesn't really matter how friendly and accepting a league is to a new player, or how much advice you give, or how much you can teach someone of the game when it all bottoms out in how much they spend on the actual game. Seeing someone get fireballed so much, when you add up the actual cost it would been enough to feed a homless shelter for a week. It doesn't make for very good game play, but I doubt that is Plariums concern in all of this.