This topic is closed

Is Diplomacy Allowed?

13 Replies
djmoody
25 September, 2016, 6:24 PM UTC

While I would appreciate a comment from Plarium staff to definitely answer this post, all comments from the wider community are welcome too, it would be great to get your opinions too.

The question about diplomacy which was raised was:

Sara Walker said:

.....NAPS are not part of the game and are a form of cheating..... no matter if its used in other games or not , it is not part of the rules of stormfall

In game functions ally us to tag leagues as allies / at peace / neutral / enemies / at war. That is it. No context can be provided. 

Does ally mean no attacks on castles, settlements, fiefs, hamlets. Can you attack an allies beacons or fortress? Does it mean any attacks are OK on allies? Does it allow for leagues to work together? 

Is it cheating to discuss and define your relationships further, outside of the game screens. Is it cheating to agree not to attack each other via a non-agression pact (NAP)? 

Is the meta game outside of the game a crucial part of your enjoyment of the game or like Sara do you believe because if it's not explicitly stated in the rules then must be against the rules and therefore cheating? How many leagues in Stormfall are currently cheating if this is true. 

Look forward to your comments and opinions, caused quite a stir in the league section of the forum, will probably get a more balanced discussion from the impartial posters in general discussion. It will be great to put this one to bed.

Everyone has a right to an opinion. No one has a right to their opinion being respected by other if it can't be backed up with rational and logic explanation
UTC +0:00
0
djmoody
25 September, 2016, 6:26 PM UTC

This was my personal opinion and initial response.


DJ Moody said:


You appear to have missed the most important aspect of MMO's generally and this genre in particular.

The developers create the sandbox and the player generate content out of it. This is hugely important in a game like Stormfall as there is hardly any content in game at all - Raid - BG - PvP.

By far the most interesting part of this game is the "meta-game" the game outside the game, where diplomacy, allies, spying, backstabbing all play a part. That is by far the most interesting content this game provides because unlike the game or any computer controlled AI, people are hugely complex and therefore that side of the game is extremely interesting.

This is what keep the veterans here long after the actual game becomes a grind. It's what keeps anyone who is interested in strategy here and this is a strategy game.

To suggest people limited themselves only to the exact features in-game is to limit the possibility of all games and kill the very point of playing multi-player on-line games.

Everyone has a right to an opinion. No one has a right to their opinion being respected by other if it can't be backed up with rational and logic explanation
UTC +0:00
0
exxxe
25 September, 2016, 6:33 PM UTC

i guess the answer goes to sarah walker 


no NAP's are not part of the game but they are part of the gameplay let me explain 


you cant go to embassy and click a tab called NAP's no all you get is leagues and their status (ally, enemy ,,,,etc)


however some leagues would decide to make peace together where a group of leagues agree to not attack each other sometimes even without being allies such agreements are NAP's 


now in game there is no NAP that would strict raids or siege (as the restriction found in attacking an allied league beacon)


however it is there empowered by the moral and honor of the leagues that would create/ join one 


NAP's are NOT against rules because it is based on players decision's ( the same way two players decide to not attack each other NAP's are at leagues level)


hope that helps 

I'am me and that is what i care about :)
UTC +3:00
0
brunsonthomas
25 September, 2016, 6:41 PM UTC
The game is not set up to require you to follow rules. If it were the Flag tournament could never work. You could never attack an Ally Beacon which is done regularly. There are a few hard enforced rules. You cannot raid, siege or Fireball yourself. Other than that Leagues can form and break diplomatic status, players within Leagues can break diplomatic status, that does not mean retaliation may not be swfit. Players can be expelled from Leagues for breaking rules. Allies will retaliate against roge League members and League members may choose to ignore those actions. This is what makes the game challenging rules are flexible depending on who wants to follow them.
UTC +5:00
0
Alyona Kolomiitseva
Community Manager
26 September, 2016, 9:27 AM UTC

Hi!

NAPs are not cheats. Game mechanics doesn't allow you to limit actions between two leagues. That's like in real life - by default you agree not to commit any crimes, but there won't be any error messages if you try.

The same here - Diplomacy is more about trust and reliability than real in-game limits. There still can be some people who break the rules set my League management, and there's still a chance you will be attacked by an ally who was just pretending to be your friend.

To sum up, NAPs are allowed, any other kinds of diplomacy are allowed. But going against your League's diplomacy is also allowed (you may be kicked out of your League for doing that, but you still don't break any game rules).

Plarium Community Manager. Please note that I will be unable to respond to your private messages, review your tickets, or check your account information. All technical issues should be directed to our Support Team at plrm.me/Support_Plarium
UTC +2:00
0
IronApex Turok
26 September, 2016, 9:57 AM UTC

the Meta game.  thats what keeps me in this. 


i once coined my way to the top and i watched that kill a game.  but in the process, i learned the finer points of leadership and diplomacy. I learned the shadow game. the game that is played out  like a game of chess. where my actions cause reactions and so forth.   T


being able to predict what the rest of you will do if i do this or that is what keeps thrill in the game.


organzing players and leagues, and manipulating those relationships is what really moves this game.


if you were to take that away,  well, we might as well be playing candy crush.
UTC +0:00
1
Sarah Walker
26 September, 2016, 3:21 PM UTC
If naps are not part of the game but are part of the gameplay , then i think i raised a valid point , players need to be made aware of these unwritten rules especially the new players 
UTC +0:00
0
Lady Nerium KT-S2
26 September, 2016, 4:53 PM UTC
If they're "unwritten" then as a leader, you're failing your league. Everyone needs to know what the operating rules are within your league, and there are plenty of ways to pass on this information to new players.
I think, therefore I game.
UTC +5:00
1
Oracle
27 September, 2016, 9:04 AM UTC

My take is yes NAP are part of the game, But the NAP in question is rather as Walker has said a ''form of cheating''.

We must not any of us not forget what the ''NAP'' in question really propose, a bunch of super leagues doing a bunch of handshaking and killing a bunch of little leagues every time the marshal in the bunch of super league decide to breath like now.  

I quit these game twice, saw 3 good league destroyed. and it was partly due to these NAP and the consequences it have when fighting start, and blood is spilled. Now a bunch of super league are at it again, the Beacon map is utterly ruined. When the fighting stop, when the handshaking starts,  and you see the happy freaky faces flying in PM of these super leagues, the bunch of small leagues will suffer. 

Agreements like these naturally ruin the game. league X and league Y should be allowed to fight alone without and interference of League A and B. All leagues should be alllowed to have a beacon anywhere on the map, whenever they deem it fit to have it. the NAP places the map on a table and cut it in pieces. first it was in 3, portion, then 2 then 4 Now it seem to be getting to 3. 

1. KT weather they can hold or not hold a beacon in the south west, hold a over 20 beacons there, we saw they could really hold as much when someone down over 7 of their beacons. What was the consequences, More fighting and dire sufferings to smaller leagues. 

2. Destiny worthy now it seem to hold only 2 beacon, will utter loudly that they own without a doubt any beacon in the North east. They too it seem can't hold their terrotory

3. Anarchy in SE

4. Unforgiven and In the West

5. KoC, a league long on a death row, hold NW together with its ally KoA

Weather you see it as a breach or rule, is up to you. I see it as discrimination, And a show of of imperialism. I must include that all those leagues are Pro English league, So in other words we will likely never ever have a league in the top ten that is not pro English. Should these NAP persist, I see  no way the game will be fair in any level. 


Biohazard has killed the forum.
UTC +2:00
0
Gadheras
27 September, 2016, 11:39 AM UTC
oracle said:

My take is yes NAP are part of the game, But the NAP in question is rather as Walker has said a ''form of cheating''.

We must not any of us not forget what the ''NAP'' in question really propose, a bunch of super leagues doing a bunch of handshaking and killing a bunch of little leagues every time the marshal in the bunch of super league decide to breath like now.  

I quit these game twice, saw 3 good league destroyed. and it was partly due to these NAP and the consequences it have when fighting start, and blood is spilled. Now a bunch of super league are at it again, the Beacon map is utterly ruined. When the fighting stop, when the handshaking starts,  and you see the happy freaky faces flying in PM of these super leagues, the bunch of small leagues will suffer. 

Agreements like these naturally ruin the game. league X and league Y should be allowed to fight alone without and interference of League A and B. All leagues should be alllowed to have a beacon anywhere on the map, whenever they deem it fit to have it. the NAP places the map on a table and cut it in pieces. first it was in 3, portion, then 2 then 4 Now it seem to be getting to 3. 

1. KT weather they can hold or not hold a beacon in the south west, hold a over 20 beacons there, we saw they could really hold as much when someone down over 7 of their beacons. What was the consequences, More fighting and dire sufferings to smaller leagues. 

2. Destiny worthy now it seem to hold only 2 beacon, will utter loudly that they own without a doubt any beacon in the North east. They too it seem can't hold their terrotory

3. Anarchy in SE

4. Unforgiven and In the West

5. KoC, a league long on a death row, hold NW together with its ally KoA

Weather you see it as a breach or rule, is up to you. I see it as discrimination, And a show of of imperialism. I must include that all those leagues are Pro English league, So in other words we will likely never ever have a league in the top ten that is not pro English. Should these NAP persist, I see  no way the game will be fair in any level. 


It's a pvp game, there is winners and there is loosers, no one is entited to anything, anything is up for grabs, and if you can't hold onto something, you didn't deserve it to start with. In a PVP game where you the underdog, its all about playing smart. If you a small league, sitting on becons is not the smart thing to do.
UTC +2:00
0
Alyona Kolomiitseva
Community Manager
27 September, 2016, 11:52 AM UTC
Lady Nerium KT-S2 said:

If they're "unwritten" then as a leader, you're failing your league. Everyone needs to know what the operating rules are within your league, and there are plenty of ways to pass on this information to new players.
Exactly. By the way, our developers have accepted the idea to let Marshalls send automatic PMs to their new recruits so they could be aware of the League rules.
Plarium Community Manager. Please note that I will be unable to respond to your private messages, review your tickets, or check your account information. All technical issues should be directed to our Support Team at plrm.me/Support_Plarium
UTC +2:00
1
djmoody
27 September, 2016, 3:02 PM UTC

Alyona Kolomiitseva said:


Lady Nerium KT-S2 said:


If they're "unwritten" then as a leader, you're failing your league. Everyone needs to know what the operating rules are within your league, and there are plenty of ways to pass on this information to new players.
Exactly. By the way, our developers have accepted the idea to let Marshalls send automatic PMs to their new recruits so they could be aware of the League rules.

That is an awesome update - brilliant new.

I am sure we are not the only league that has a captain dedicated to sending out the welcome and orientation messages. This will remove a boring task, give people back some of their time and let them get on with enjoying the game.
Everyone has a right to an opinion. No one has a right to their opinion being respected by other if it can't be backed up with rational and logic explanation
UTC +0:00
0
Lady Nerium KT-S2
28 September, 2016, 2:20 AM UTC
You're not the only league DJ.
I think, therefore I game.
UTC +5:00
0
Alyona Kolomiitseva
Community Manager
28 September, 2016, 6:23 AM UTC
I'm glad that you like this idea. And I really hope it will be implemented soon.
Plarium Community Manager. Please note that I will be unable to respond to your private messages, review your tickets, or check your account information. All technical issues should be directed to our Support Team at plrm.me/Support_Plarium
UTC +2:00
0
1780306 users registered; 48354 topics; 287211 posts; our newest member:hazargungul