Poaching players from other leagues

23 Replies
scorpic
25 April, 2016, 4:19 PM UTC
What are the thoughts of the community? 
UTC +0:00
Skycooldude
25 April, 2016, 8:57 PM UTC
I see no problem with it. if another league can offer something to a member that your league can't, then good for that league. Imo it gives leadership in leagues an incentive to do things to keep the members happy so they don't jump ship and go to another league.
UTC +0:00
Lady Nerium KT-S2
27 April, 2016, 4:40 AM UTC
I don't approach anyone in an established league, but if they approach me first I will talk to them and offer an invite if they meet the requirements and seem like they would fit in the league.
I think, therefore I game.
UTC +5:00
darkness69
27 April, 2016, 4:47 AM UTC

UTC +10:00
Gadheras
27 April, 2016, 6:57 AM UTC


I see no problem in "shopping for players" to make your own league stronger. But it only work if you can offer something the players other league can't, or you can sell them a vision of a future the player currently don't have in his current league.


If you work hard to get your league stronger and better, you try assemble the best team you can. And if you feel you had members get poached from your league. Heck, I guess you didn't do a good job to keep them around. 


PVP oriented games is more about success and progress, not so much about being a social club.
UTC +2:00
Fortuneteller
27 April, 2016, 10:09 AM UTC

Gadheras said:


PVP oriented games is more about success and progress, not so much about being a social club.

I have to disagree here. Nothing compares to a friendly and cohesive 'social group' working toward a common goal and, if that bond involves other leagues, that's even better! A league that values its active members and treats them fairly will go a long way. If you are unable to make friends and be a human being in this game you will soon find yourself targeted by people who stick together.


Back to poaching ... I have done it, there's nothing wrong with it. But the way it is done tells a lot about you. Let me give you some random examples w/o names:

A player joins a league with his 'friends'. they get friendly with most players except the marshal. then at a strategic decision that player tries to undermine the authority of the marshal and takes a dramatic exit with all his 'friends' then makes his own league. People will leave, as they can only see half a dozen players moving to another league. 

Another very similar example in which an alt of a marshal in a bigger league joins a smaller, active league. He trashes the marshal/captains deliberately when a decision is made only to suggest to join another league (where he is a marshal).



FT
UTC +0:00
Mehnslayer
27 April, 2016, 11:03 AM UTC

Fortuneteller said:


Gadheras said:


PVP oriented games is more about success and progress, not so much about being a social club.

I have to disagree here. Nothing compares to a friendly and cohesive 'social group' working toward a common goal and, if that bond involves other leagues, that's even better! A league that values its active members and treats them fairly will go a long way. If you are unable to make friends and be a human being in this game you will soon find yourself targeted by people who stick together.


Back to poaching ... I have done it, there's nothing wrong with it. But the way it is done tells a lot about you. Let me give you some random examples w/o names:

A player joins a league with his 'friends'. they get friendly with most players except the marshal. then at a strategic decision that player tries to undermine the authority of the marshal and takes a dramatic exit with all his 'friends' then makes his own league. People will leave, as they can only see half a dozen players moving to another league. 

Another very similar example in which an alt of a marshal in a bigger league joins a smaller, active league. He trashes the marshal/captains deliberately when a decision is made only to suggest to join another league (where he is a marshal).



Still taking cheap shots at me ey'? Also you might need a fact check, you are referring to me however I wasn't the first to leave, and I also wasn't the one to poach your members, they followed.


E 'n la sua volontade è nostra pace
UTC +11:00
jumy
27 April, 2016, 11:46 AM UTC

Fortuneteller said:


I have to disagree here. Nothing compares to a friendly and cohesive 'social group' working toward a common goal and, if that bond involves other leagues, that's even better! A league that values its active members and treats them fairly will go a long way. If you are unable to make friends and be a human being in this game you will soon find yourself targeted by people who stick together.


Back to poaching ... I have done it, there's nothing wrong with it. But the way it is done tells a lot about you. Let me give you some random examples w/o names:

A player joins a league with his 'friends'. they get friendly with most players except the marshal. then at a strategic decision that player tries to undermine the authority of the marshal and takes a dramatic exit with all his 'friends' then makes his own league. People will leave, as they can only see half a dozen players moving to another league. 

Another very similar example in which an alt of a marshal in a bigger league joins a smaller, active league. He trashes the marshal/captains deliberately when a decision is made only to suggest to join another league (where he is a marshal).



I say it's all distorted, a community "friendly" are not 10 people x100 castles or 100 x1000 or who else gets behind a castle, in this game they are all friends with 300 leagues and mysterious castles (alts of alts=10 real ppl)

when realize that everything is not real and unplayable will be late 

The truth hurts
UTC +12:00
Fortuneteller
27 April, 2016, 12:12 PM UTC

Mehnslayer said:


Still taking cheap shots at me ey'? Also you might need a fact check, you are referring to me however I wasn't the first to leave, and I also wasn't the one to poach your members, they followed.

No,  I was not referring to you. You just said it wasn't you and I think I've never questioned anything you've told me. On top of that, I listened and asked for your input many times. I was only referring to people with bad intent and how we perceived things from our perspective. If you feel like it describes you, that's your call. Since you mentioned, I had a mail from a person who left my league weeks later you were gone, saying that creating a new league was the plan all along.  So, of course they followed you. If only you were honest with me right from the start I wouldn't have let you and your friends in the first place ;-)

Look, I was merely sharing a story that fits into the thread. You are the one who's trying to publicly identify yourself with one of the stories. If you think I was wrong, message me instead. I respect privacy and so should you. 

FT
UTC +0:00
Gadheras
27 April, 2016, 12:15 PM UTC

Fortuneteller said:


Gadheras said:


PVP oriented games is more about success and progress, not so much about being a social club.

I have to disagree here. Nothing compares to a friendly and cohesive 'social group' working toward a common goal and, if that bond involves other leagues, that's even better! A league that values its active members and treats them fairly will go a long way. If you are unable to make friends and be a human being in this game you will soon find yourself targeted by people who stick together.


Back to poaching ... I have done it, there's nothing wrong with it. But the way it is done tells a lot about you. Let me give you some random examples w/o names:

A player joins a league with his 'friends'. they get friendly with most players except the marshal. then at a strategic decision that player tries to undermine the authority of the marshal and takes a dramatic exit with all his 'friends' then makes his own league. People will leave, as they can only see half a dozen players moving to another league. 

Another very similar example in which an alt of a marshal in a bigger league joins a smaller, active league. He trashes the marshal/captains deliberately when a decision is made only to suggest to join another league (where he is a marshal).




Its typical that inside a guild/league whatever. There is clicques of players, and a core of players. The core of the players is what bind the entire thing together, when the core break up, the entire thing is in danger of fall apaert.


Lets say I had 10 friends and I joined a league. I found out shit man, this place sucks. Me and my 10 buddies would find another place, and good chance someone else would tag along in the process. 


Of all the guys in my league I chat with maybe a few regulary. The rest is kinda like, I dunno, extras? In a league of 100+ people you can't be a buddy and social with everyone. And good chance there would be a few amongst those 100+ that you loathe. 

It might be cosy to take your scout troop into the woods and sit around the bonfire singing. I would prefer prefer a bunch of guys that was eager to lay waste to anything in their path and be as effective killing machine as possible, above the sing along :p Its like if I had the choice between the nicest person in the worl, but he wasn't very active and didn't do much for the team, I would swapped him/her out with someone that put in the time and effort to make the team better.


Also I call bullocks on your example. Either you lead or you don't. If you a good marshall you have players follow you, if someone come in and try break things up, you should be able to resolve that fast through your skills of leadership. Failing to do so, just prove you wasn't ready to be a Marshall to start with. Everyone can start a guidl/league, to make it successfull, that is another tale.




UTC +2:00
Fortuneteller
27 April, 2016, 12:35 PM UTC

Gadheras said:


Its typical that inside a guild/league whatever. There is clicques of players, and a core of players. The core of the players is what bind the entire thing together, when the core break up, the entire thing is in danger of fall apaert.


Lets say I had 10 friends and I joined a league. I found out shit man, this place sucks. Me and my 10 buddies would find another place, and good chance someone else would tag along in the process. 


Of all the guys in my league I chat with maybe a few regulary. The rest is kinda like, I dunno, extras? In a league of 100+ people you can't be a buddy and social with everyone. And good chance there would be a few amongst those 100+ that you loathe. 

It might be cosy to take your scout troop into the woods and sit around the bonfire singing. I would prefer prefer a bunch of guys that was eager to lay waste to anything in their path and be as effective killing machine as possible, above the sing along :p Its like if I had the choice between the nicest person in the worl, but he wasn't very active and didn't do much for the team, I would swapped him/her out with someone that put in the time and effort to make the team better.


Also I call bullocks on your example. Either you lead or you don't. If you a good marshall you have players follow you, if someone come in and try break things up, you should be able to resolve that fast through your skills of leadership. Failing to do so, just prove you wasn't ready to be a Marshall to start with. Everyone can start a guidl/league, to make it successfull, that is another tale.




Hi, You as an outsider may have certain beliefs of what might've happened, I'll give you that.  What you don't know, and clearly don't get is that the people who came to the league were only planning to stay temporarily and take a dramatic exit when they were all here and ready to create a league for their own.

The players  were not  'my players' to start with. They were here because they were told to join by a certain person who then also told them to leave when the time was right. Simple. It is not about my leadership skills it is about the fact that even if I wanted to, I had no influence over the things. But, ultimately, that was the goal, wasn't it?

I know there are people here who only understand power, and $$$ in this game and they think that everyone who has a different point of view is not fit to be in a pvp context. You are confusing basic humanly behaviour to utter incompetence. I don't blame you, probably that's what you are used to here, but I can assure you, that it is not the case with us.


I'd rather gather players around me I can have a good chat and relation with great team-work, than those who are just with me because I coin my way up and if my wallet is empty or my league is beaten by a bigger dog they leave in the first instance. Different approach to things, nothing wrong with that.

My examples were not 'bullocks' and only one of them happened to us. Not sure where you have the audacity to jude me on anything that happened and you have no idea about. So I'm not even going into that. As you said everyone can start a guild and how YOU made it successful, that is another tale.
FT
UTC +0:00
Mehnslayer
27 April, 2016, 12:44 PM UTC

I'm in tears, this is beautiful lol


If this isn't directed at me you have some problems within the league that need some resolving. Even though your example pin points me hard. Wish I had the chat logs but sadly they are forever gone :( 

E 'n la sua volontade è nostra pace
UTC +11:00
Fortuneteller
27 April, 2016, 12:46 PM UTC
Mehnslayer said:

I'm in tears, this is beautiful lol

If this isn't directed at me you have some problems within the league that need some resolving. Even though your example pin points me hard. Wish I had the chat logs but sadly they are forever gone :( 
*hands over a tissue* Not once have I named you, get over it :-)
FT
UTC +0:00
Mehnslayer
27 April, 2016, 12:52 PM UTC

Fortuneteller said:


Mehnslayer said:


I'm in tears, this is beautiful lol

If this isn't directed at me you have some problems within the league that need some resolving. Even though your example pin points me hard. Wish I had the chat logs but sadly they are forever gone :( 
*hands over a tissue* Not once have I named you, get over it :-)

"This is beautiful" might of been an important part of that context, Plarium give us a kappa button, Kthanks

I'm not gonna argue subjective points because its a pointless he said she said, limp bizkit made a song about us titled "Break stuff".

As for my opinion on O.P, poaching is fine, however I would argue at the same time that it could be considered a hostile act and or "treason", so I mean, give or take. If Russia tried to hire the U.S marshals, I'm sure USA wouldn't be too happy about that situation. The argument can be made for harassing messages / attacks to force people to join, that I disagree with... But the wonders of humans is subjectivity, instead of pure objectivity 
E 'n la sua volontade è nostra pace
UTC +11:00
Gadheras
27 April, 2016, 1:08 PM UTC

Fortuneteller said:


Gadheras said:


Its typical that inside a guild/league whatever. There is clicques of players, and a core of players. The core of the players is what bind the entire thing together, when the core break up, the entire thing is in danger of fall apaert.


Lets say I had 10 friends and I joined a league. I found out shit man, this place sucks. Me and my 10 buddies would find another place, and good chance someone else would tag along in the process. 


Of all the guys in my league I chat with maybe a few regulary. The rest is kinda like, I dunno, extras? In a league of 100+ people you can't be a buddy and social with everyone. And good chance there would be a few amongst those 100+ that you loathe. 

It might be cosy to take your scout troop into the woods and sit around the bonfire singing. I would prefer prefer a bunch of guys that was eager to lay waste to anything in their path and be as effective killing machine as possible, above the sing along :p Its like if I had the choice between the nicest person in the worl, but he wasn't very active and didn't do much for the team, I would swapped him/her out with someone that put in the time and effort to make the team better.


Also I call bullocks on your example. Either you lead or you don't. If you a good marshall you have players follow you, if someone come in and try break things up, you should be able to resolve that fast through your skills of leadership. Failing to do so, just prove you wasn't ready to be a Marshall to start with. Everyone can start a guidl/league, to make it successfull, that is another tale.




Hi, You as an outsider may have certain beliefs of what might've happened, I'll give you that.  What you don't know, and clearly don't get that the people who came to the league were only planning to stay temporarily and take a dramatic exit when they were all here and ready to create a league for their own.

The players  were not  'my players' to start with. They were here because they were told to join by a certain person who then also told them to leave when the time was right. Simple. It is not about my leadership skills it is about the fact that even if I wanted to, I had no influence over the things. But, ultimately, that was the goal, wasn't it?

I know there are people here who only understand power, and $$$ in this game and they think that everyone who has a different point of view is not fit to be in a pvp context. You are confusing basic humanly behaviour to utter incompetence. I don't blame you, probably that's what you are used to here, but I can assure you, that it is not the case with us.


I'd rather gather players around me I can have a good chat and relation with great team-work, than those who are just with me because I coin my way up and if my wallet is empty or my league is beaten by a bigger dog they leave in the first instance. Different approach to things, nothing wrong with that.

My examples were not 'bullocks' and only one of them happened to us. Not sure where you have the audacity to jude me on anything that happened and you have no idea about. So I'm not even going into that. As you said everyone can start a guild and how YOU made it successful, that is another tale.

I don't really care what happend. I'm just saying, if you a great Marshall/leader, such situations is easy to resolve. Your fellow league members should have no problem cut through the bollocks. And as such if a outside group came in with the intent to take as many of your guys and leave, well players would only leave if they unhappy/discontent about their current situation.


Imho, you want to suround yourself with the right people at all times, the ones you describe that would just follow someone that is a big coiner, or would leave your league if you face some hardship, such players you shouldnt let into your league to start with. Screening and processing new recruits for a successfull guild is important -)



UTC +2:00
Fortuneteller
27 April, 2016, 1:28 PM UTC

Gadheras,

Fyi, the core stayed :-)


The comic strip is funny!

We normally run bg checks by federal agencies while one of us is so onto the Neophyte that he also becomes one. Then I will look into my crystal ball or tea leaves and see what dirty secrets I can dig up on that player. I love doing that, in fact, I love thinking that people join a league just to cause trouble, spy and whatnot so, I also had a Sphinx installed at our gates. If they don't answer its riddle correctly, we simple raid the soul out of that newbie until he quits and starts playing farmville once again.

better? ;-)

FT
UTC +0:00
Mehnslayer
27 April, 2016, 1:32 PM UTC

Already playing farmville


E 'n la sua volontade è nostra pace
UTC +11:00
Gadheras
27 April, 2016, 1:36 PM UTC

Fortuneteller said:


Gadheras,

Fyi, the core stayed :-)


The comic strip is funny!

We normally run bg checks by federal agencies while one of us is so onto the Neophyte that he also becomes one. Then I will look into my crystal ball or tea leaves and see what dirty secrets I can dig up on that player. I love doing that, in fact, I love thinking that people join a league just to cause trouble, spy and whatnot so, I also had a Sphinx installed at our gates. If they don't answer its riddle correctly, we simple raid the soul out of that newbie until he quits and starts playing farmville once again.

better? ;-)


The difference between a kid game such as this and like EVE; you can read easy here @ https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/03/08/here-we-go-again-600bn-isk-stolen-in-eve-heist/


Bottom line is, if you careless about letting people into your guild without good screeing it will bite you in the ass later. And if the core stayed, then why even get butthurt over such. 

UTC +2:00
Gadheras
27 April, 2016, 1:40 PM UTC

Mehnslayer said:


Already playing farmville



Never have and never will play farmville, but from what I see other people played it, it seems much faster phased than stormfall.... :p


UTC +2:00
Fortuneteller
27 April, 2016, 1:45 PM UTC

Gadheras said:


Fortuneteller said:


Gadheras,

Fyi, the core stayed :-)


The comic strip is funny!

We normally run bg checks by federal agencies while one of us is so onto the Neophyte that he also becomes one. Then I will look into my crystal ball or tea leaves and see what dirty secrets I can dig up on that player. I love doing that, in fact, I love thinking that people join a league just to cause trouble, spy and whatnot so, I also had a Sphinx installed at our gates. If they don't answer its riddle correctly, we simple raid the soul out of that newbie until he quits and starts playing farmville once again.

better? ;-)


The difference between a kid game such as this and like EVE; you can read easy here @ https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/03/08/here-we-go-again-600bn-isk-stolen-in-eve-heist/


Bottom line is, if you careless about letting people into your guild without good screeing it will bite you in the ass later. And if the core stayed, then why even get butthurt over such. 

Thanks, I've come across with EVE online, not my cup of tea.


I was giving examples of bad poaching... or not poaching at all, but rather things-that-may-damage-morale-and-result-in-accidental-poaching. I get 'butthurt' because I care DUH

FT
UTC +0:00
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