I started off primarily a def player but from bgs mostly it has been changed and i have changed my style so to that now my offence is about 3x stronger than my def

yup totally agree with this and have seen it develop this way in my own account as well

1.playing BG is the only way to grow units and yes the bank payout favours Offence

2.in an attack players lose more on Def compare to Offence

3.with the existence of Cat, there's no need to have Def units except for beacons

Just try visiting Stormfall on the Kabam.com server where there are dozens of abandoned beacons - Defense is dead and burried - Long live Offense

You will also see that all forts are level zero, 5 or 8 .... none contain defense

The Flag Tournament was a hideous joke - 2 Leagues captured EVERY flag on the entire server

SeriousSummer said:

I think the answer is to greatly increase the defensive force multiplier for beacons. A level 5 beacon should have a defensive multiplier of 5, and the same for every level of beacon. That way there would be a fair chance to hold on to beacons.

i don't know much about beacons, when you say multiplier of 5, do you mean a 500% increase?  in risk you get an xtra dice, that being a 50% increase for defense.  other games i play have a 5% to 20% increase for both offense and defense depending on terrain.  beacons are a big deal, maybe a 500% increase is proper, maybe not.

that doesn't fix all defense though.  the terrain bonus of a fully walled castle, from what i have read,  seems to be a low percentage as well.  my castle is not fully walled or beyond level 1, and i don't have alot of other improvements either. so i don't know.  {tbh, i don't do formulas.}

but what i don't understand on beacons would be high ranking leagues having trouble defending them.  from what i've seen an attacker can send 3 players at a time and high ranking leagues have a 100 strong players defending.

so it is the issues that create a scenario that 3 players can effectively take on 100 that needs fixed the most.  but i don't know about beacons.  it seems to me that djmoody's points of emphasis are  a start.

SeriousSummer said:

I think the answer is to greatly increase the defensive force multiplier for beacons. A level 5 beacon should have a defensive multiplier of 5, and the same for every level of beacon. That way there would be a fair chance to hold on to beacons.

i don't know much about beacons, when you say multiplier of 5, do you mean a 500% increase?  in risk you get an xtra dice, that being a 50% increase for defense.  other games i play have a 5% to 20% increase for both offense and defense depending on terrain.  beacons are a big deal, maybe a 500% increase is proper, maybe not.

that doesn't fix all defense though.  the terrain bonus of a fully walled castle, from what i have read,  seems to be a low percentage as well.  my castle is not fully walled or beyond level 1, and i don't have alot of other improvements either. so i don't know.  {tbh, i don't do formulas.}

but what i don't understand on beacons would be high ranking leagues having trouble defending them.  from what i've seen an attacker can send 3 players at a time and high ranking leagues have a 100 strong players defending.

so it is the issues that create a scenario that 3 players can effectively take on 100 that needs fixed the most.  but i don't know about beacons.  it seems to me that djmoody's points of emphasis are  a start.

I've seen different posts about Offense-Defense balance. 

Offenders say this game is for defenders, they have all those Defense boosts in Castles, in Beacons. No real opportunity to overwhelm Defense with current attack limits.

Defenders say Offense is much stronger for the same cost, the bank payout favours Offence, they have Joint attacks, etc.

From this point it looks like it's well-balanced. Of course if you play on one side, you can see all cons of your situation and all pros of your rival's situation. But in fact game balance is considered by several departments, it's analyzed and calculated. 

It's not accidental. And I really doubt our game balance will be changed in the near future. As soon as there are some real reasons for changes which can be proven mathematically, our devs will make their step.

Wake up for the love of god why can't you listen to the feedback.

It's not balanced, it exactly the opposite and the server I play on is about to tip because of it. Everyone in the thread agrees. No one is disagreeing (other than you). 

1) This isn't a post about small scale fights on castles. It's about the league scale game on beacons.

2) It's insulting to the quality of the post to just say all of us aren't considering the pros and cons and our rivals position. This post was made because it's bad for EVERYONE, rivals, allies, my league. Not a myopic post from only my personal point of view, post is completely unbiased for the good of the server.

3) If the answer to every point is you have departments working on it and our opinion must be wrong then is there any point in feedback at all. That attitude simply say you think you know best and will never listen to feedback 

4) Sad as it is to say I know a lot more about this game than anyone at Plarium. I have the advantage of playing it 24/7 and being connected to the whole community, multi leauges, on a daily basis via Teamspeak. You guys sit in an ivory tower, disconnected from your players. If you need proof, I know how to trick BG's, something your "experts" have failed to stop over the course of the entire year. I could have fixed that for you in 5 minutes. 

If you want mathematical proof of what I already know is true:

- ask for the total offence and total defence stats for each server.

- ask for the sapphire to power and sapphire to resource value of units and see how much more expensive defence is to buy

- ask for the def/off ratio of a what is suppoed to be a defence split payout in BGs, and have the ratio provided based on troop numbers (the way your game runs), power of the troops and resource value of the troops.

The second two explain the massive imbalance between off and def you will find from the first one.

I am not going to bother making any further feedback to be honest, because hundreds of hours of providing feedback has let to absolutely no changes ever. More often than not it's met by some knee-jerk post that clearly exhibits the Plarium staff didn't even understand the point

Alyona Kolomiitseva said:

djmoody said:

Wake up for the love of god why can't you listen to the feedback.

I do hear you, don't worry. And this feedback will be passed to devs. However, I told you how it looks from the outer point of view. 

I would love to hear more from the psycho serial killers who control this game

Snowgoon said:

Alyona Kolomiitseva said:

djmoody said:

Wake up for the love of god why can't you listen to the feedback.

I do hear you, don't worry. And this feedback will be passed to devs. However, I told you how it looks from the outer point of view. 

I would love to hear more from the psycho serial killers who control this game

They have every advantage and none of the disadvantages, so why do they still complain?

Remember back in the day when playing Planetarion. If one side in the game got to strong, they ended the round and started over. With a game like this if one side become so incredible strong doe to massive coining or what not. The only medecine to fight it is even more coining, which is just ridicilous. Its like an arms race and its our wallets that got to bleed for it. I got other games to play that offer cheaper and better fun.

"alexander wept for there were no more worlds to conquer"  Life on top not necessary any more fun when whats left is just to steam roll anything in their way. So in the end its like "gg guys you won, now lets find something else to play". Who got the biggest regrets after something like that? the ones who spent a fortune maybe. But at least they had their 15 minutes of fame -)

Alyona Kolomiitseva said:

I've seen different posts about Offense-Defense balance. 

Offenders say this game is for defenders, they have all those Defense boosts in Castles, in Beacons. No real opportunity to overwhelm Defense with current attack limits.

Defenders say Offense is much stronger for the same cost, the bank payout favours Offence, they have Joint attacks, etc.

From this point it looks like it's well-balanced. Of course if you play on one side, you can see all cons of your situation and all pros of your rival's situation. But in fact game balance is considered by several departments, it's analyzed and calculated. 

It's not accidental. And I really doubt our game balance will be changed in the near future. As soon as there are some real reasons for changes which can be proven mathematically, our devs will make their step.

It's not an offenders vs defenders thing, it's more a leagues vs individual players thing.  If all you have to defend is your castle, and you have level 5 walls, then defense seems way better (the introduction of fireballs has mostly nullified this).  But for most players, who want to participate in league activities such as fortresses and beacons, then offense has a massive advantage. 

example:  If you hit a beacon with 3 times as much offense as the defense in the beacon, you'll kill 1.34x as much defense as you lose in offense.  This has already more than made up for the 25% bonus on a level 5 beacon.  Several leagues now have the ability to do a joint attack with over 1 billion offense, meaning that any beacon under 300 million defense can be easily overwhelmed. 

This is the internet, you can find people saying just about anything.  But the vast majority of players who are experienced in the game agree that it is highly skewed towards offense, and the math seems to support this. 

yeah, but with 1.5 billion (and growing) hammers, beacons are pointless.

i think the emperors have pointed out that any and every beacon is defeatable.  If a league wants your beacon, why defend it.  You are just going to lose that defense in there and will take 3 years to build it back.

on that same line of thinking, what do you do with that defense if you arent putting it in a beacon?   no one fights at castles any more, again, defense is going to lose. So just park it in a catacomb?

maybe fortresses, but then again, with no safe zone, that seems a waste as well. in order to updgrade you  have to take down same level fortresses. 

with the offense cap on fortress attacks, all one has to do is stuff the fortress to the gills with the beacon defense you arent using and it makes attacking a fortress pointless.

if everyone does that, then how are you going to knock a fortress down a level to increase yours?

yeah, but with 1.5 billion (and growing) hammers, beacons are pointless.

i think the emperors have pointed out that any and every beacon is defeatable.  If a league wants your beacon, why defend it.  You are just going to lose that defense in there and will take 3 years to build it back.

on that same line of thinking, what do you do with that defense if you arent putting it in a beacon?   no one fights at castles any more, again, defense is going to lose. So just park it in a catacomb?

maybe fortresses, but then again, with no safe zone, that seems a waste as well. in order to updgrade you  have to take down same level fortresses. 

with the offense cap on fortress attacks, all one has to do is stuff the fortress to the gills with the beacon defense you arent using and it makes attacking a fortress pointless.

if everyone does that, then how are you going to knock a fortress down a level to increase yours?

you have just rendered both features of the game useless.   Building defense is pointless.

Dont you think overpowered offense or defense is highly overrated in this game?

For an example you can have thousands of dragons and lose more then really needed to when a battle or war. As your loses are based on percentages only.

So people who spend all this money on thousands of dragons not to bright and not sure why ppl waste all this money.

adding additional defense bonuses would balance things out

split rewards on battle grounds make it hard for anyone who is trying to improve their defensive army, if you play defense bg to improve your defense stats and are rewarded with a split of offense and defense troops you are actually losing defense

Alyona Kolomiitseva said:

Thanks, Biohazard! That will be really helpful.

I just have one question. What about Defense Bonuses on Beacons and Castles? They make Defense way more effective. Defense doesn't have such boosts only on Hamlets, League Fortresses. Should we take this bonus into account?

And one more thing I guess. While defending a Fortress or a Beacon, there are 100+ defenders (if your League is big enough), but only 1-2-3 attackers at a time. This results in less losses for the defending side, because the Defense in overwhelming. Isn't this balancing the situation somehow?

I just need as many details as possible before talking to devs about this issue.

The defense bonus on castles can certainly be significant, and is the reason why many people just fireball castles instead of attacking them.  As for the beacon bonus, the fact that it is a 25% boost to the base defense value of the units means that the effective boost is far less.  For a high level player, they can attain a multiplier on their defense of about 2.4 (with 50% bonus and hero items, not counting dragon stone), and the 25% beacon bonus changes that to 2.4+0.25=2.65, for an effective bonus of 10.4% on a level 5 beacon.  This makes some difference, but not nearly enough to compensate for the other factors I mentioned. 

Yes, there can be up to 160 defenders in a league, but their defense is usually split over a fortress, multiple beacons, their castles, and probably some hamlets or settlements etc.  Whereas the attackers are usually the 3 biggest players in a league, attacking with 100% of their offense on a single target.