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Masteries Question

Masteries Question

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Oct 22, 2021, 15:2810/22/21
08/27/21
27

Masteries Question

Now that I finally have enough ranked up Champions to rank up Ninja (I'm assuming this is still the best option - my other Legendary is Bad-el-Kazaar.  My Epics are Jizoh and Sandlashed Survivor (haven't use either of these much), and High Khatun (have been using).

I am now looking at Masteries.  I had put added some to some Champions for progress missions but I want to redo them and be more purposeful this time.  So, I was looking at Hellshades site (awesome site, mad props and thanks) and there are two options for suggested - PvP and PvE....what's the difference?  If I have to chose, I prefer to do well in the dungeons over campaigns or arenas but I haven't gotten into faction wars or Doom Tower yet....

I may make some better in one area over another but I'm not sure how to read that part of the site.  I'm also not sure how to understand what each mastery is when reading in-game.

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Oct 22, 2021, 15:3510/22/21
06/25/20
6429

PVP = arena. Ignore it for the most part, you're too early to worry about it.

Oct 22, 2021, 16:1910/22/21
04/14/20
1343

PvP and PvE stand for 'Player vs Player' and 'Player vs Enemy' - common terms in MMOs. In this game, though, there is no real PvP - even in the game modes where you are fighting a team of another player, it's the AI that is actively controlling their champions, not they themselves. But indeed, it refers to arena / tag team arena. 

However, the real distinction to make with your masteries is whether you want to make the champion a) stronger against bosses in dungeons, DT, Faction Wars, the Clan Boss, or b) stronger against waves of non-boss enemies (in arena or on the waves of dungeons, DT, FW). In the first case, that almost always means going for the Warmaster or Giantslayer masteries on the offense tree, as well as some other masteries which e.g. increase your damage against enemies with higher max HP than yours. In the second case, you'd go for other masteries, like the ones that give you bonus damage or bonus speed after each kill, heal you on each kill, etc. HH basically uses 'PvE' and 'PvP' as a short hand for those two approaches. 

At your level of progress, focus on the 'PvE masteries'. It's the dungeon bosses that are the problem for you now, and the Clan Boss of course. Those masteries will be less useful in arena, but they'll still help some. Besides arena, it's mostly only in the end-game that you really need the masteries focused on waves of enemies - for Faction Wars and Doom Tower especially. 

Oct 22, 2021, 16:4010/22/21
08/27/21
27

Thanks both!  That makes sense.  @kramaswam.kr - very consice, I always appreciate concise.

@L9753 - you are always helpful with detailed answered. I thought I was translating PvP and PvE correctly in my head but was confused because as you say, I'm not *really* against another player (in that another live player is against me in the arenas) but they are teams built by players.

Now I know where to concentrate my most used Champions for now and keep the other advice in mind for down the road.

Oct 22, 2021, 16:5810/22/21
04/14/20
1343

By the way, congrats on Bad El Kazar, I don't remember if you mentioned before that you have him. He's amazing - yes, Ninja should still be your first 6* because he's more suited for campaign farming, but BEK is probably a better champion with more added value overall. And for your legendary books, give BEK priority, at least for his second skill cooldown reduction. 

Oct 22, 2021, 17:5910/22/21
08/27/21
27

Thanks for the tip, yeah, I got him a while ago....had to open 2 sacred shards to complete the task for another game but I really enjoy this one as well so I keep playing it.  I like all the strategy in it but I need a second device to really play it well - both my main games share a device and it can get cumbersome at times to try to be very active in both.

Oct 23, 2021, 01:2310/23/21
10/15/20
2046
L9753

PvP and PvE stand for 'Player vs Player' and 'Player vs Enemy' - common terms in MMOs. In this game, though, there is no real PvP - even in the game modes where you are fighting a team of another player, it's the AI that is actively controlling their champions, not they themselves. But indeed, it refers to arena / tag team arena. 

However, the real distinction to make with your masteries is whether you want to make the champion a) stronger against bosses in dungeons, DT, Faction Wars, the Clan Boss, or b) stronger against waves of non-boss enemies (in arena or on the waves of dungeons, DT, FW). In the first case, that almost always means going for the Warmaster or Giantslayer masteries on the offense tree, as well as some other masteries which e.g. increase your damage against enemies with higher max HP than yours. In the second case, you'd go for other masteries, like the ones that give you bonus damage or bonus speed after each kill, heal you on each kill, etc. HH basically uses 'PvE' and 'PvP' as a short hand for those two approaches. 

At your level of progress, focus on the 'PvE masteries'. It's the dungeon bosses that are the problem for you now, and the Clan Boss of course. Those masteries will be less useful in arena, but they'll still help some. Besides arena, it's mostly only in the end-game that you really need the masteries focused on waves of enemies - for Faction Wars and Doom Tower especially. 

I have to disagree. HellHades does not use PvP as synonym for PvE wave content (and it is the right decision from him not to do so).

For example Thylessia: the option "nuker" is the same in PvP and PvE, but the option "debuffer" in PvE includes Warmaster as tier 6 masterie, while "dec def" PvP has Eagle Eye - for a good reason: Arena opponents usually have higher res than dungeon waves (in higher arena stages, you don't need Eagly Eye in bronze or silver).

There are more differences between these areas of the game. In general you can assume that your opponents in arena hit much harder, but have less hp than PvE enemies.

Oct 23, 2021, 11:2110/23/21
04/14/20
1343
Skadi

I have to disagree. HellHades does not use PvP as synonym for PvE wave content (and it is the right decision from him not to do so).

For example Thylessia: the option "nuker" is the same in PvP and PvE, but the option "debuffer" in PvE includes Warmaster as tier 6 masterie, while "dec def" PvP has Eagle Eye - for a good reason: Arena opponents usually have higher res than dungeon waves (in higher arena stages, you don't need Eagly Eye in bronze or silver).

There are more differences between these areas of the game. In general you can assume that your opponents in arena hit much harder, but have less hp than PvE enemies.

I won't claim to be an expert in HellHades' site, as I generally consult Ayumilove instead, but I've done some comparisons between the two in the past. Which is partially what my reply was based on: Ayumi shows two builds for most champions, one of them named 'Arena, Doom Tower, Faction Wars' and the other 'Campaign, Clan Boss, Dungeons'. And those two largely correspond to HH's 'PvP' and 'PvE' builds as far as I've seen. 

To go with your example, if the 'PvP' version has Eagle Eye, it's not only for high level arena that you'd need that, but also for the hard Doom Tower where you need much higher accuracy than normal. Of course, that goes for the DT bosses as well as the waves, on the bosses the Warmaster approach may still make more sense but as you'd be using the same champions on waves and bosses probably, might go for Eagle Eye for DT builds overall. Same way that for dungeons, you'd go with the Warmaster approach even if for the waves separately, you might prefer another path. 


Oct 26, 2021, 14:3010/26/21
08/27/21
27

Not sure if I can add to this thread or start a new one....looking for advice on who to work on next - I want another Champion ranked up during CvC if I can (ranked up Ninja this morning)

Bad Al-Kazar to 6 stars (may not make it during CvC)

High Khatun to 5 stars

Sandlashed Survivor to 5 stars (I've used this one less so her artifacts aren't upgraded as much and she isn't ascended as high as High Khatun).

Oct 26, 2021, 14:3210/26/21
06/25/20
6429

BEK no question. He'll carry you through dungeons.

Oct 26, 2021, 15:2910/26/21
08/27/21
27

Awesome, thanks - I'll work on ranking up all the sacrifice champions and probably rank him up next CvC since I don't think I'll get enough 5 stars before end of this one.

Oct 26, 2021, 16:0310/26/21
04/14/20
1343
Mostreal

Awesome, thanks - I'll work on ranking up all the sacrifice champions and probably rank him up next CvC since I don't think I'll get enough 5 stars before end of this one.

At the level you're at, I wouldn't delay your next 6* by two weeks just to be able to do it during the next CvC, that doesn't make any sense. CvC points are nice, but not that nice that you should put your progress on pause inbetween. 

Oct 26, 2021, 16:3510/26/21
08/27/21
27
L9753

At the level you're at, I wouldn't delay your next 6* by two weeks just to be able to do it during the next CvC, that doesn't make any sense. CvC points are nice, but not that nice that you should put your progress on pause inbetween. 

Thanks, I'll keep that in mind - I delayed this one only a couple of days.  I will see how long it takes to get enough for the next - I have a bunch more 3 star and 4 star sacrifices now than when I was trying to rank up Ninja so it may not take me to long!  I'm going to try to rank up as many sacrifices as I can during this CvC to get the points.  

I feel a bit bad because I'm not in a horribly competitive Clan but still the bottom of the active list (we have at least 10 people that scored no points in the last CvC) and I like to pull my weight.

Oct 26, 2021, 17:1310/26/21
05/13/19
2326

I  think  you  should  go  with  Bad  El  Kazar  because he  is  number  1