Hi,

Valdys said:

Hi,

Most of the rares are material for fusions... yeah, someone is good, but they're just rares.

Hey Valdys - thanks for your perspective here. I will add though that using rares for fusions is one style of play. There are far too many interesting rares in the game, that the developers have spent too much time designing, for them to simply be food for fusions. 

I think if a champion is worth putting in the game, then they are worth assessing and balancing just like any other. While a balance to a legendary will make more of a difference, a small update to a % debuff on a rare is not a big change and should be considered. Thoughts?

Victory March said:

Maybe his lower chance to weaken is balanced by the fact that he can reduce healing and block cooldown skills?

Hey Victory - I think this is probably the best argument against it, being that it would be unbalanced to give Twinclaw access to 3 different debuffs. However, one important thing I looked into was comparing all rares with access to [Weaken]. Here is the list: 

Twinclaw, Orcs - a2 - 50% chance of 15% [weaken]

Grappler, Skinwalkers - a1 - 15% chance of 15% [weaken]

Halbedier, Banner Lords - a1 - 25% chance of 25% [weaken]

Interceptor, High Eves - slightly different, due to possibility of other debuffs. 

Bone Knight, Undead Hordes - a1 - 15% chance of 15% [weaken]

Stitched Beast, Undead Hordes - a2 - 25% chance of 25% [weaken]

Wanderer, Dark Elves - a1 - 30% chance of 15% [weaken]

Harvester, Dark Elves - a1 - 35% chance of 15% [weaken] 

Bulwark, Dwarves - a1 - 15% chance of 15% [weaken]

**addition** Hellfang, Demonspawn - a2 - 50% chance of 25% [weaken]

It is important to note that Twinclaw also gets a 50% chance. However, the cooldown counts against this percentage, as even with a high percentage Twinclaw does not have access to it every turn being that it occupies his A2 spot. Also Stitched Beast attacks TWICE, each for 25% chance, which is similar to Twinclaw's single hit with 50% chance, yet Stitched Beast benefits from the 25% [Weaken] debuff. 

If you notice in the list above, any champion with a 15% [Weaken] debuff has it in their Attack 1, meaning more frequent access. It makes sense to lower a % debuff in this space. However, all champions with [Weaken] in their Attack 2 have a 25% [Weaken] debuff. 

The other champions have access to similar debuffs as Twinclaw, so the number of debuffs in his kit should not prevent him from having access to a 25% [Weaken] debuff as is the norm of other champions in his rarity class. 

Completely upgrading his Tender Carve skill would equal 20% more damage, a 75% chance, and a -1 cool-down.  Don't know if that makes a difference compared to the others.

Victory March said:

Okay, well, I really don't know if it would make him unbalanced to improve his weaken ability or not.  Still, if you like him, you can make him powerful enough to be useful. 

My thought would be that raising to 25% weaken debuff would be balancing, but I'd appreciate others' opinions on this as well. Thanks for your insight here, I'm a big fan of Twinclaw but he is overshadowed by other champions due to this 15% version. Essentially, any other champion would be a better option for this skill due to this, but I understand his kit is pretty diverse and I'm really focusing on just one piece of the puzzle. 

I don't know the level, rank, or rarity of gear you've equipped him with, or what stats are on the gear.

Das_Phyllis said:

Valdys said:

Hi,

Most of the rares are material for fusions... yeah, someone is good, but they're just rares.

Hey Valdys - thanks for your perspective here. I will add though that using rares for fusions is one style of play. There are far too many interesting rares in the game, that the developers have spent too much time designing, for them to simply be food for fusions. 

I think if a champion is worth putting in the game, then they are worth assessing and balancing just like any other. While a balance to a legendary will make more of a difference, a small update to a % debuff on a rare is not a big change and should be considered. Thoughts?

Also what is the proper forum to request a change like this? New to the forum, and would like for this to be seen by the community manager. 

This is the right section and you are already talking to a moderator.

ayumilove.net puts this rare in a F category which means is a BAD RARE, position 48, imagine that of a trash rare to be put so low...  i use him as food, for some reason  i constantly get dupes of this  champion; i only save one for a fusion if needed.

https://ayumilove.net/raid-shadow-legends-list-of-champions-by-ranking/

Valdys said: 

This is the right section and you are already talking to a moderator.

Btw, he was really a fusion material and he won't get buffed.

Thanks for the info on the forum! As for the second part about Twinclaw, I do not agree with this at all, why would they take the time to give him 3 debuffs, and unlockable a3 via ascension, and a backstory, and cool design if he really was only fusion material? What you're saying is not backed by facts, unless you can find evidence the devs truly said this. 

ayumilove.net puts this rare in a F category which means is a BAD RARE, position 48, imagine that of a trash rare to be put so low...  i use him as food, for some reason  i constantly get dupes of this  champion; i only save one for a fusion if needed.

https://ayumilove.net/raid-shadow-legends-list-of-champions-by-ranking/

 

Valdys said: 

Btw, he was really a fusion material and he won't get buffed.

Thanks for the info on the forum! As for the second part about Twinclaw, I do not agree with this at all, why would they take the time to give him 3 debuffs, and unlockable a3 via ascension, and a backstory, and cool design if he really was only fusion material? What you're saying is not backed by facts, unless you can find evidence the devs truly said this. 

Darktreader said:

Das_Phyllis said:

Valdys said: 

Btw, he was really a fusion material and he won't get buffed.

Thanks for the info on the forum! As for the second part about Twinclaw, I do not agree with this at all, why would they take the time to give him 3 debuffs, and unlockable a3 via ascension, and a backstory, and cool design if he really was only fusion material? What you're saying is not backed by facts, unless you can find evidence the devs truly said this. 

It is backed by facts. He has been fusion material for two fusions so far Brakus the shifter and Cillian the Lucky.  Thats means he has been fusion material for 15% of all fusions.

Hey Darktreader, thanks for your post here! This is exactly what I was looking for here, more facts. Ok this helps form my picture of this champion a bit better. 

I do still believe though that rares, even those that are found in Campaign, consistently in fusions, etc. still serve a viable purpose outside of food and fusion material. For instance, why give Goremask a 25% HP in Arena aura if he was strictly meant for the Rhazin fusion? The same is true for Twinclaw Disciple. Even though the majority of his use has been in fusions, he is still able to be used in all content of the game. For this reason, he deserves to be looked at for balancing and putting him on par with comparable champions. 

Raven Fugazity said:

As far as I can tell... Rare champs won't get reworked, EVER, only Legos and Epics do. And I hope it stays like that because if they start reworking not farmable rares they may start nerfing others, and if they do I RIOT!

Ah so there lies the larger issue, complete champion rework. Doing Twinclaw Disciple justice may cause an injustice to other champions... but I guess what's balanced is balanced. The truth will set us free!