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All the Supreme Starters (and the March Fusion)

All the Supreme Starters (and the March Fusion)

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harleQuinnModerator
Mar 7, 2023, 21:5203/07/23
02/24/19
7174

All the Supreme Starters (and the March Fusion)

Here is Supreme Elhain, the March Fusion, and all her buddies...

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What do we think? Any of them interesting to y'all?

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138
Comments
53
Comments
Mar 7, 2023, 22:0603/07/23
06/25/20
6138

Kael is unquestionably the best of the four, and is almost certainly an auto-include in several dungeons, simply because all his abilities are unresistable.

Galek is probably the second best. His utility is far more niche - I sorta see him as filling the same boat as Ninja. I can see him having value in Hydra, and of course in any content that HPBurn comes into play, as well as potentially being a decent solo dungeon champ.

Elhain I think is where I draw the line at viability. I think she *may* have some use in arena, but that's about it.

Athel I think is just plain bad. Her kit just doesn't mesh at all. I cannot for the life of me understand why they made her A2 freeze *after* doing damage, when all of the first part of her A2 requires the targets to be frozen to kick in. Is there some strange alternate reality in Plarium, where they expect an ATK-based champ to function as a go2 retaliatory CC, and then also somehow have enough damage to do anything at all with an ATK-based nuke?

dthorne04Moderator
Mar 7, 2023, 22:1703/07/23
12/30/20
5292

Galek and Kael are the clear winners but I'd be windmill slamming Galek over Kael. That kit is just bonkers good for Hydra. 

Mar 7, 2023, 22:1903/07/23
09/14/20
937

I agree with Krama in his evaluation of the champions but would probably exchange the rating of Athel and Elhaine.

Overall I think Galek and Kael are worthy void legendaries while Athel and Elhaine will remain in the vault for a long time. Especially Elhaine is just a nuker and I would rate her as a mediocre non-void and a weak void champ. I agree that Kael has the strongest kit...but I would actually prefer Galek because of his use in Hydra.

Overall I would have preferred to have Galek or Kael in the fragment fusion and I hope there is a future fragment or fusion event to obtain one of them. 

I hope Plarium will not just make x10 for Galek/Kael to moneytize on them but actually design the rest of the 4th anniversary to be more enjoyable. 

It would have been great if the fragment event starting this week would have been for supreme fragments and everybody could have choosen their own favorite Supreme Starter...it would have been a blast for the player base and everybody would have accepted higher points for this special fragment event. Placing Elhain as one of the weaker ones in the fragment event and heightening the points requirements just seems wrong to me. 

Mar 7, 2023, 22:2003/07/23
09/14/20
937
dthorne04

Galek and Kael are the clear winners but I'd be windmill slamming Galek over Kael. That kit is just bonkers good for Hydra. 

Damn, I should not have used that many words to say the same as you did..;-)

harleQuinnModerator
Mar 7, 2023, 22:2003/07/23
Mar 7, 2023, 22:21(edited)
02/24/19
7174
kramaswamy.kr

Kael is unquestionably the best of the four, and is almost certainly an auto-include in several dungeons, simply because all his abilities are unresistable.

Galek is probably the second best. His utility is far more niche - I sorta see him as filling the same boat as Ninja. I can see him having value in Hydra, and of course in any content that HPBurn comes into play, as well as potentially being a decent solo dungeon champ.

Elhain I think is where I draw the line at viability. I think she *may* have some use in arena, but that's about it.

Athel I think is just plain bad. Her kit just doesn't mesh at all. I cannot for the life of me understand why they made her A2 freeze *after* doing damage, when all of the first part of her A2 requires the targets to be frozen to kick in. Is there some strange alternate reality in Plarium, where they expect an ATK-based champ to function as a go2 retaliatory CC, and then also somehow have enough damage to do anything at all with an ATK-based nuke?

Kael's not exceptional, in my opinion cause he's just another poisoner and we have plenty of those... at least until you get to his irresistable AoE Decrease Resistance coupled with a team Increase Accuracy buff. That is a monster skill, and it solves some of that previous champ issue of "Who cares if you have Dec Res, you still need 600 accuracy to reliably land it to get started, and need to keep it up 100% of the time.

Laugh at Danger on Galek seems fun, with all the bosses throwing around debuffs like they do now.

I am perhaps MOST excited about Elhain, just cause I need other ways to delete Nek protected champs and delete Marichkas . Elhain's single target delete comes with an Extra Turn so I can follow up with a nuke. Taras/Marichka are now on 75%ish of the top 30 teams in Plat, and that number is growing week to week.... and have been everywhere in G4 Tag in my experience.... and they are an absolute pain to deal with you can't debuff cause you get sheeped. Elhain fits in a place to deal with them so I'm not trying to make it work with Ronda and Shamael.

As far as Athel.... I am not sure how I could use her yet.

harleQuinnModerator
Mar 7, 2023, 22:2203/07/23
02/24/19
7174
Matrim

I agree with Krama in his evaluation of the champions but would probably exchange the rating of Athel and Elhaine.

Overall I think Galek and Kael are worthy void legendaries while Athel and Elhaine will remain in the vault for a long time. Especially Elhaine is just a nuker and I would rate her as a mediocre non-void and a weak void champ. I agree that Kael has the strongest kit...but I would actually prefer Galek because of his use in Hydra.

Overall I would have preferred to have Galek or Kael in the fragment fusion and I hope there is a future fragment or fusion event to obtain one of them. 

I hope Plarium will not just make x10 for Galek/Kael to moneytize on them but actually design the rest of the 4th anniversary to be more enjoyable. 

It would have been great if the fragment event starting this week would have been for supreme fragments and everybody could have choosen their own favorite Supreme Starter...it would have been a blast for the player base and everybody would have accepted higher points for this special fragment event. Placing Elhain as one of the weaker ones in the fragment event and heightening the points requirements just seems wrong to me. 

Quick note that we have no idea what the point requirements are going to be for Elhain's fusion. Higher than the last? Lower? It's not public knowledge at this point. :)

Mar 7, 2023, 22:2803/07/23
Mar 7, 2023, 22:29(edited)
09/14/20
937
harleQuinn

Quick note that we have no idea what the point requirements are going to be for Elhain's fusion. Higher than the last? Lower? It's not public knowledge at this point. :)

I agree, I am just extrapolating (perhaps wrongly) from the last IG tournament.

That said, if they would have done an event like described above, I would have happily accepted an event-based increase of points as it would stil give me the choice of picking my favorite champ (SupGalek). 

 

dthorne04Moderator
Mar 7, 2023, 22:2903/07/23
12/30/20
5292
harleQuinn

Kael's not exceptional, in my opinion cause he's just another poisoner and we have plenty of those... at least until you get to his irresistable AoE Decrease Resistance coupled with a team Increase Accuracy buff. That is a monster skill, and it solves some of that previous champ issue of "Who cares if you have Dec Res, you still need 600 accuracy to reliably land it to get started, and need to keep it up 100% of the time.

Laugh at Danger on Galek seems fun, with all the bosses throwing around debuffs like they do now.

I am perhaps MOST excited about Elhain, just cause I need other ways to delete Nek protected champs and delete Marichkas . Elhain's single target delete comes with an Extra Turn so I can follow up with a nuke. Taras/Marichka are now on 75%ish of the top 30 teams in Plat, and that number is growing week to week.... and have been everywhere in G4 Tag in my experience.... and they are an absolute pain to deal with you can't debuff cause you get sheeped. Elhain fits in a place to deal with them so I'm not trying to make it work with Ronda and Shamael.

As far as Athel.... I am not sure how I could use her yet.

Kael's kit seems good in a vacuum, I just don't know what I - or those in similar situations - need him for. Galek fills a really, really important role and I could see him just being an utter DPS monster in Hydra.

Perhaps I'm underrating Elhain, but she's likely the only one I'm going to see out of the bunch anyway. :) I am curious to see how she shines, whether it be in a reasonable speed ignore defense build or perhaps a super slow build in which we just wait out Stone Skin and snipe off champs. 

harleQuinnModerator
Mar 7, 2023, 22:3103/07/23
02/24/19
7174
Matrim

I agree, I am just extrapolating (perhaps wrongly) from the last IG tournament.

That said, if they would have done an event like described above, I would have happily accepted an event-based increase of points as it would stil give me the choice of picking my favorite champ (SupGalek). 

 

Some of the recent fusions have been very high, ones like Pythion were criminally easy to finish. (Well Pythion was criminally easy to finish if you didn't skip early events thinking to get summon rush done with like 4 sacreds, lol, but you could skip Summon Rush basically entirely)

Picking the fusion would have been cool, I wouldn't have said no to that.... but the last tourney points have nothing to do with the next fusion, they have bounced around on the points for those a lot in the last few fusions it seems, even skipping historical events entirely.

Mar 7, 2023, 22:3203/07/23
09/14/20
937
dthorne04

Kael's kit seems good in a vacuum, I just don't know what I - or those in similar situations - need him for. Galek fills a really, really important role and I could see him just being an utter DPS monster in Hydra.

Perhaps I'm underrating Elhain, but she's likely the only one I'm going to see out of the bunch anyway. :) I am curious to see how she shines, whether it be in a reasonable speed ignore defense build or perhaps a super slow build in which we just wait out Stone Skin and snipe off champs. 

SupElhain really depends on her stats as she in my opinion has nothing else to bring to the table. If she does not do immense damage, she is not that useful. If her A3 would also include ignoring Stoneskin, it would have been a must-go....this way I have enough nukers for arena to do the same thing she does...dealing tons of damage...

harleQuinnModerator
Mar 7, 2023, 22:3403/07/23
02/24/19
7174
dthorne04

Kael's kit seems good in a vacuum, I just don't know what I - or those in similar situations - need him for. Galek fills a really, really important role and I could see him just being an utter DPS monster in Hydra.

Perhaps I'm underrating Elhain, but she's likely the only one I'm going to see out of the bunch anyway. :) I am curious to see how she shines, whether it be in a reasonable speed ignore defense build or perhaps a super slow build in which we just wait out Stone Skin and snipe off champs. 

I'll be trying an Ignore Defense build and attempting to snipe Marichka and then double AoE the rest of the team with her and an HP champ.

As far as Galek, he's awesome I think. Great in Hydra and would go into my current teams.

Kael once again fall into the "Who the heck needs another poisoner?" category. Sure, he's a strong poisoner, but those are a dime a dozen now. 2019 he'd have been the best PvE champ in the game, but against CURRENT content he's not getting in anywhere instead of my already built teams.

Mar 7, 2023, 22:3903/07/23
12/19/19
5922
Matrim

SupElhain really depends on her stats as she in my opinion has nothing else to bring to the table. If she does not do immense damage, she is not that useful. If her A3 would also include ignoring Stoneskin, it would have been a must-go....this way I have enough nukers for arena to do the same thing she does...dealing tons of damage...

I'm guessing elhain will disappoint due to poor multipliers.

Love the idea you suggested as being able to pick 1 of the 4, and they could have made the whales chase every tournament to get 155 and buy up a 2nd of their choice.  


Mar 7, 2023, 22:4003/07/23
09/14/20
937
harleQuinn

I'll be trying an Ignore Defense build and attempting to snipe Marichka and then double AoE the rest of the team with her and an HP champ.

As far as Galek, he's awesome I think. Great in Hydra and would go into my current teams.

Kael once again fall into the "Who the heck needs another poisoner?" category. Sure, he's a strong poisoner, but those are a dime a dozen now. 2019 he'd have been the best PvE champ in the game, but against CURRENT content he's not getting in anywhere instead of my already built teams.

Hmm, regarding Sup Kael, I would perhaps use him in DoomTower waves and dungeons. I think his best ability is his passive (Degrade). Hide him behind a Kalvalax and make him faster than the PvE opponents and you will get no crits from them and their accuracy is reduced by 20%...that not bad...(12% initially)

Mar 7, 2023, 22:4203/07/23
12/19/19
5922

Are they viable for the new hard dungeons, NM hydra or tag?

harleQuinnModerator
Mar 7, 2023, 22:4603/07/23
02/24/19
7174
Trips

I'm guessing elhain will disappoint due to poor multipliers.

Love the idea you suggested as being able to pick 1 of the 4, and they could have made the whales chase every tournament to get 155 and buy up a 2nd of their choice.  


The rumor going around of her multis is actually a totally fabricated leak :D

harleQuinnModerator
Mar 7, 2023, 22:5003/07/23
02/24/19
7174
Matrim

Hmm, regarding Sup Kael, I would perhaps use him in DoomTower waves and dungeons. I think his best ability is his passive (Degrade). Hide him behind a Kalvalax and make him faster than the PvE opponents and you will get no crits from them and their accuracy is reduced by 20%...that not bad...(12% initially)

Sure, for a progression champ he's cool. Many would be happy to have him. I mean, you could say that about any of the champs except maybe Athel depending on the account. 

But I have absolutely zero need for help in anything other than any upcoming Hydra difficulties, potential upcoming content, and Tag/Plat arena.

Champs that fit into the "oh cool, another poisoner" don't move the needle for me at all. With a base CR at 15%, I am not super invested in reducing PvE CR any further though. Resistance numbers aren't that tough to hit anymore either, at least in my opinion.  

Galek does move the needle though, he can get into Hydra teams. :D

Mar 7, 2023, 22:5703/07/23
06/25/20
6138

One thing to remember about Galek - the passive has a 4-turn cooldown. I'm not really seeing him being a monster in Hydra as a result. I think he fills basically the same role Ninja does. The passive acts as the cooldown-reducing A3 that Ninja has, and the A3 does the HPburn-part of the A2 from Ninja. The ATK up on his A2 is largely irrelevant, I think. The only big thing is the block buffs part - so I'll give you that he'll fill the role better than Ninja, an open up a bit more design space for the team, but I don't see him as being a big gamechanger here.

Mar 7, 2023, 22:5803/07/23
06/25/20
6138
harleQuinn

Sure, for a progression champ he's cool. Many would be happy to have him. I mean, you could say that about any of the champs except maybe Athel depending on the account. 

But I have absolutely zero need for help in anything other than any upcoming Hydra difficulties, potential upcoming content, and Tag/Plat arena.

Champs that fit into the "oh cool, another poisoner" don't move the needle for me at all. With a base CR at 15%, I am not super invested in reducing PvE CR any further though. Resistance numbers aren't that tough to hit anymore either, at least in my opinion.  

Galek does move the needle though, he can get into Hydra teams. :D

I think the unresistable part of Kael's kit can't be understated. I can absolutely see future content having increasingly absurd resists, to the point where having a champ that can place all those debuffs as well as reduce damage *significantly, will be very important.

Mar 7, 2023, 22:5903/07/23
06/25/20
6138

Also, regarding the reducing CR to zero part - I think CB is a really good example of how powerful that effect is. Reducing variability allows you to optimize gear *far* more efficiently.

Mar 7, 2023, 23:0303/07/23
09/14/20
937
kramaswamy.kr

I think the unresistable part of Kael's kit can't be understated. I can absolutely see future content having increasingly absurd resists, to the point where having a champ that can place all those debuffs as well as reduce damage *significantly, will be very important.

*chuckle* than let's just hope that SupKael was actually intended to be used in this way and will not be nerfed because nobody thought he will be used in this new content...