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Spoiler alert / early criticism

Spoiler alert / early criticism

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Oct 24, 2022, 18:5910/24/22
06/25/20
6210

Spoiler alert / early criticism

Take with a grain of salt, of course, since this is leaked info

https://www.reddit.com/r/RaidShadowLegends/comments/yc45m8/upcoming/

Specifically - New Gear Set: Defiant 2 Set: DEF +10%. -15% Damage taken from enemy AoE attacks Can be forged from Defiant Chunks 

Plarium, I'm gonna pre-empt you here. If you are honestly planning on adding this set - DON'T.

Because if you do a forge pass with this set, it will 100% be a P2W item set. -45% AoE damage +30% DEF is going to absolutely trivialize basically all PvE bosses.

*EDIT*

Looks like this is official from Plarium now, too. It's listed here:

https://raid-support.plarium.com/hc/en-us/articles/360014657140-Artifacts-Overview

i


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33
Comments
31
Comments
Oct 24, 2022, 19:0110/24/22
12/19/19
5995

You are concerned about PvE being easier for some? 

Oct 24, 2022, 19:0210/24/22
06/25/20
6210
Trips

You are concerned about PvE being easier for some? 

I'm concerned about a set that is going to require all new content to be designed with it in mind, yes.

Oct 24, 2022, 19:0210/24/22
Oct 24, 2022, 19:03(edited)
12/19/19
5995

Isn't it a 4pc set?  So just a stalwart plus...


Oct 24, 2022, 19:0410/24/22
10/11/20
366

That might explain why they added the whole "poisons in the Arena" and "HP burn in the Arena" - if things continue this route, it might be the only way to kill the opponent before we all die of old age. 

Oct 24, 2022, 19:0510/24/22
06/25/20
6210
Trips

Isn't it a 4pc set?  So just a stalwart plus...


No, it's a 2-piece set. Hence my criticism.

Oct 24, 2022, 19:1210/24/22
12/19/19
5995
kramaswamy.kr

No, it's a 2-piece set. Hence my criticism.

Meh... I think bolster is far more OP.... but these limited forge pass releases make the gear far less useful.   Getting a 6pc set with good stats will take how many seasons of forge pass?

Curious question as to those with bolster pass, did you get more than 1 "good" set from 2 seasons...


Oct 24, 2022, 19:1410/24/22
06/05/22
433

yeah, as a 2-piece set this looks very strong. I know stalwart isn't the most exciting set ever, but 2 sets of this is an additional 20% defense, same as fortitude (very strong) vs resist (mediocre).

Oct 24, 2022, 19:2610/24/22
06/25/20
6210
Trips

Meh... I think bolster is far more OP.... but these limited forge pass releases make the gear far less useful.   Getting a 6pc set with good stats will take how many seasons of forge pass?

Curious question as to those with bolster pass, did you get more than 1 "good" set from 2 seasons...


Only need one :) though I haven't tested whether I've got any upgrades with the second one yet.

Bolster is meta-changing for arena, but for everywhere else, it's no different from shield. -45% AoE damage though, is just going to completely trivialize content.

harleQuinnModerator
Oct 24, 2022, 19:2610/24/22
Oct 24, 2022, 19:35(edited)
02/24/19
7259
kramaswamy.kr

No, it's a 2-piece set. Hence my criticism.

Naw, it's not. Fairly sure it'll be 4 like all the other Forge sets. From your Plarium link there.... The middle column is the number of pieces per set.

i

I'll ask and see if they need to change the (2) under the icon. :)

Oct 24, 2022, 19:2910/24/22
06/25/20
6210

Alright. Well. You can delete this thread, then :) My concerns are alleviated.

dthorne04Moderator
Oct 24, 2022, 19:3210/24/22
12/30/20
5386
Trips

Meh... I think bolster is far more OP.... but these limited forge pass releases make the gear far less useful.   Getting a 6pc set with good stats will take how many seasons of forge pass?

Curious question as to those with bolster pass, did you get more than 1 "good" set from 2 seasons...


My definition of good might be different than yours, but yep, got a few good - if not strong - builds out of the first season of Bolster. Still haven't crafted Season 2 yet. 

harleQuinnModerator
Oct 24, 2022, 19:3710/24/22
Oct 24, 2022, 20:52(edited)
02/24/19
7259
kramaswamy.kr

Alright. Well. You can delete this thread, then :) My concerns are alleviated.

Honestly after looking at it a bit more, we won't know for sure which one it is until we see the official announcement by Plarium. I personally didn't expect this set to pop up on the website already, regardless of the spoilers rolling around the last week. 4 pieces is looking unlikely.

If it is 2 piece set, this is an unskippable Forge Pass, it would seem like. Single Target DPS back in the meta immediately. Baron and Hephraak the Kings are dead.... long live the Kings.


Oct 24, 2022, 19:4510/24/22
12/19/19
5995
harleQuinn

Honestly after looking at it a bit more, we won't know for sure which one it is until we see the official announcement by Plarium. I personally didn't expect this set to pop up on the website already, regardless of the spoilers rolling around the last week. 4 pieces is looking unlikely.

If it is 2 piece set, this is an unskippable Forge Pass, it would seem like. Single Target DPS back in the meta immediately. Baron and Hephraak the Kings are dead.... long live the Kings.


Based on the stats it looks like a 2pc set, maybe with a max usage of 2 sets for the 4.... they would have to make it 30% if 4pc...


harleQuinnModerator
Oct 24, 2022, 19:4610/24/22
02/24/19
7259
Trips

Based on the stats it looks like a 2pc set, maybe with a max usage of 2 sets for the 4.... they would have to make it 30% if 4pc...


I don't disagree. :)

Oct 24, 2022, 21:2710/24/22
06/05/22
433
Trips

Meh... I think bolster is far more OP.... but these limited forge pass releases make the gear far less useful.   Getting a 6pc set with good stats will take how many seasons of forge pass?

Curious question as to those with bolster pass, did you get more than 1 "good" set from 2 seasons...


As a mid-game player, I got 1 pretty good set, which I put on Dreng for doom tower, and a bunch of ok ones for faction wars. I still have about 80 pieces to roll as I ran out of hp glyphs.

I share your concern though. It's not worth investing too much into this set, as you essentially hit a plateau that's far below the quality of true end-game gear. That said, the forge pass is pretty good value for the forge (CvC points + silver), xp boosts, etc. Far far better than any non-shard pack you can buy for the same price.

Oct 24, 2022, 21:3110/24/22
06/25/20
6210

Mark my words. If this ends up being a 2-piece set, it will 100% break all PvE content, to the point that they either nerf the set, or they change boss abilities to ignore it.

Oct 24, 2022, 22:0710/24/22
05/03/20
1751

For someone like me all of the new releases make it impossible for me to plan ahead.  I keep jumping to react.  That makes the game less enjoyable.   

Oct 24, 2022, 22:1610/24/22
12/19/19
5995
kramaswamy.kr

Mark my words. If this ends up being a 2-piece set, it will 100% break all PvE content, to the point that they either nerf the set, or they change boss abilities to ignore it.

I'm still not seeing it... at all :) 

At best you have ONE champ u can gear in 6pcs of this...

How many champs do you have in stalwart?

Oct 24, 2022, 23:2110/24/22
06/25/20
6210
Trips

I'm still not seeing it... at all :) 

At best you have ONE champ u can gear in 6pcs of this...

How many champs do you have in stalwart?

If my math is correct, Forge Pass gives you 950 of the mats needed for the 5-6* items. At 5 per forge, that means you can forge a total of 190 of them with the Forge Pass. Add the six you get for reaching level 50, and you get a total of 196. Double that by the fact that they normally run this twice, and you're at 392. 

There's a 50% chance that you get a 5*, so we'll assume half of those 392 are trash. Down to 196.

We'll also be generous, and say half of the rare ones end up being trash. There's a 35% chance for rare, so we'll say 17.5% of those remaining are trash, leaving us with 162.

162 is quite a lot of crafting. My guess is that you'll easily be able to get three full, usable sets out of 162. You could very well end up with more. In comparison, FTP get 20 total. Reduce by the same above math, and you end up with a total of about 8 potentially useful items.

That sounds very much P2W to me. Especially considering those artifacts will never lose value (barring some more crazy power creeping). I stand by my original statement that this is an absolutely terrible set for them to add.

harleQuinnModerator
Oct 24, 2022, 23:3510/24/22
02/24/19
7259
kramaswamy.kr

If my math is correct, Forge Pass gives you 950 of the mats needed for the 5-6* items. At 5 per forge, that means you can forge a total of 190 of them with the Forge Pass. Add the six you get for reaching level 50, and you get a total of 196. Double that by the fact that they normally run this twice, and you're at 392. 

There's a 50% chance that you get a 5*, so we'll assume half of those 392 are trash. Down to 196.

We'll also be generous, and say half of the rare ones end up being trash. There's a 35% chance for rare, so we'll say 17.5% of those remaining are trash, leaving us with 162.

162 is quite a lot of crafting. My guess is that you'll easily be able to get three full, usable sets out of 162. You could very well end up with more. In comparison, FTP get 20 total. Reduce by the same above math, and you end up with a total of about 8 potentially useful items.

That sounds very much P2W to me. Especially considering those artifacts will never lose value (barring some more crazy power creeping). I stand by my original statement that this is an absolutely terrible set for them to add.

These numbers are very optimistic, and is a lot of assuming that you get anything decent at all even using charms. I'm not seeing anywhere near the results you've predicted.

I used charms the whole time forging Bolster, and I have a LOT of gear I need to chaos ore to try and get usuable stuff. I think I've got 1 Bolster set right now, and even so, saying it's a great or even very good set would be a reach.  

162 pieces just cannot simulate the tens of thousands of runs it takes to get the perfect substat rolls on a couple pieces that then rolls in the proper combination for super endgame gear.