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Holmgang fail

Holmgang fail

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3 июль 2022, 02:0203.07.22
05.12.17
13

Holmgang fail

So the clan decided to play Holmgang again. We are three lvl 39 not willing to cough up 500 USD each (or more) to upgrade to lvl 40. So here we are looking at our opponent : a single lvl 40 with 3.2T influence. So we already decided not to show up. Why? Because we know we don't stand a chance. We know from defending our siege tower that we get wiped away. We might as well dismiss all our T7 and T6 because that is what will happen. Is this how you imagined your game Plarium? Equal influence is simply not a reference to strength any more. Your game is unbalanced. We are willing to fight an equal opponent, but anything that reads lvl 40 is just overpowered. Either you double their influence (maybe adding 1t influence to each will do) or you put them all together in a seperate kingdom where they can fight by themselves, but this is simply flawed.

When are you going to balance out this game ?

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3 июль 2022, 04:0003.07.22
06.04.18
572

You might consider your opponent for a moment.  Entering the event and then just not showing up leaves the opponent high and dry.

3 июль 2022, 05:3903.07.22
05.12.17
13
John

You might consider your opponent for a moment.  Entering the event and then just not showing up leaves the opponent high and dry.

Indeed we told him minutes before the game started we would not show up. We had a chat in which he aknowledged the unfair advantage lvl 40's have. He even made us the kind offer not to defend 2 of each round's towers so we could grab the soul shards, but that would break the meaning of this post, so we declined the offer.

I know you are much in defence of the highest levels, but that doesn't change the math. Influence is no longer a reference to strength which means the game is broken. Argue as much as you want, the facts are undeniable. Add 1T influence to each lvl 40 and it will become a bit more balanced. But since the Aesir and VIP upgrades I am not sure that will be enough.

The interesting thing about this solution is that lower level clans get a more balanced opponent in battle events, and lvl 40 will barely feel the difference since they generally fight other clans with lvl 40's. It's a pretty clean solution. Weaker lvl 40's may complain, but they are still much stronger than any strong lvl 39.


3 июль 2022, 06:2503.07.22
11.01.17
4649

Hi Iron_Shaman, thank you for the detailed feedback, we will think on changing the current opponents assignation functionality🙏

Your comments help us to get better😇

3 июль 2022, 07:4603.07.22
3 июль 2022, 09:30(отредактировано)
05.12.17
13
Ivar Marksman

Hi Iron_Shaman, thank you for the detailed feedback, we will think on changing the current opponents assignation functionality🙏

Your comments help us to get better😇

That would be the most naive solution. Your influence rating is broken, Ivar. That means your game is broken. Your fix is like changing the tires of your car because you ran out of oil in your engine. If you fix as I mentioned above, the opponents assignation functionality doesn't need to tampered with. What makes it so difficult for you guys to admit that level 40's are overpowered? Is it really greed or sheer stupidity?

3 июль 2022, 12:5503.07.22
09.09.18
8
Iron_Shaman

That would be the most naive solution. Your influence rating is broken, Ivar. That means your game is broken. Your fix is like changing the tires of your car because you ran out of oil in your engine. If you fix as I mentioned above, the opponents assignation functionality doesn't need to tampered with. What makes it so difficult for you guys to admit that level 40's are overpowered? Is it really greed or sheer stupidity?

Every Jarl looks for an advantage in defeating its enemy and Plarium. I am a L40 2T fighter that chooses to fight small because I do not have the deeper pockets to compete with the larger clans and fighters. Because of this our clan has tried to take advantage of several cost cutting moves within the rules of Plarium. In this case I would like to mention that if you start a new clan your Holmgang level restarts and would face easier competion and still receive your bonuses. At lower levels you may not face the 3T+ powerhouse until you are ready.

Another suggestion would be to defend the forts until which time the island troops are destory and pull yours. This way you get the shards necessary to grow stronger without the cost of troop loss. I also think that it was admirable that your opponent recognized the mismatch yet was willing to work with you.

I would also like to point out that being a L39 town does have its advantages too. At L39 you do not have to compete against mega L40 towns for personal checkpoints. It is a two-edge sword in the fight with influence and strength.

I also think that because this game is multi-level that fighting take places on several levels and we are not always capable to fight in JOT or Asgard as others do. We are learning that the true value of this game the friends we make not the goals we will never reach or attain.

Many L40 towns are very active with what we call the "grind" which strengthens their towns through town skins, gear, gems and achievements without raising their influence. Currently their are not check and balances for this in the game and has produced lopsided match ups. There are no easy answers but I hope that this helps in suggesting ways that you can still find enjoyment in the game and be victorious.


3 июль 2022, 13:2603.07.22
06.04.18
572

Equal influence never has equated to equal strength.

Your proposed fix has the benefit of simplicity - upgrading to Palace 40 currently increases influence by 14B, increasing that to 1.14T would no doubt be a simple thing to accomplish.

Of course you have plucked a figure out of the air so whether it would have the desired effect or not is a matter of blind chance.  A bit like trying olive oil in your Harley when you run out of oil in your engine.

If Plarium Global Ltd cared two hoots about such matters they would have devoted a couple of servers to testing and recruited some players willing to give a few hours to beta testing game upgrades or testing ideas like yours.  Don't hold your breathe on that.

In the meantime you might look at how your clan might drop a trillion influence.  That would have the result you seek and lies in your own hands.  Perhaps one of the three members drops out, forms their own clan and allies.  Or can you slim down on those TVI and TVIIs?

Your opponent showed considerable grace.  A pity you did not take up the compromise offer.

3 июль 2022, 14:0903.07.22
3 июль 2022, 14:53(отредактировано)
05.12.17
13
John

Equal influence never has equated to equal strength.

Your proposed fix has the benefit of simplicity - upgrading to Palace 40 currently increases influence by 14B, increasing that to 1.14T would no doubt be a simple thing to accomplish.

Of course you have plucked a figure out of the air so whether it would have the desired effect or not is a matter of blind chance.  A bit like trying olive oil in your Harley when you run out of oil in your engine.

If Plarium Global Ltd cared two hoots about such matters they would have devoted a couple of servers to testing and recruited some players willing to give a few hours to beta testing game upgrades or testing ideas like yours.  Don't hold your breathe on that.

In the meantime you might look at how your clan might drop a trillion influence.  That would have the result you seek and lies in your own hands.  Perhaps one of the three members drops out, forms their own clan and allies.  Or can you slim down on those TVI and TVIIs?

Your opponent showed considerable grace.  A pity you did not take up the compromise offer.

Reducing influence will no longer allow us to participate in Holmgang. The limit for that is 3T and we are 3,2 together, like our opponent. Taken into consideration that we constantly have to create T7 just to get Runecoins needed for town and heroskins, it's pretty tough to stay skinny on influence. Dismissing troops takes huge amounts to get the benefits of achievement lvl 11 and is mostly just a waste.

As for not accepting the compromise, he made nothing of it. I wanted to make a point and it would have been rather hypocritical to take it after having posted here. On the other hand I'm kinda happy with the reactions here. Bottom line is that I may not have earned soul shards, I didn't lose troops or rss. Sometimes towns from ajacent Holmgang games come in and attack our towns while we are focussed on fortresses. 

3 июль 2022, 14:2403.07.22
05.12.17
13
P00L N00DLE

Every Jarl looks for an advantage in defeating its enemy and Plarium. I am a L40 2T fighter that chooses to fight small because I do not have the deeper pockets to compete with the larger clans and fighters. Because of this our clan has tried to take advantage of several cost cutting moves within the rules of Plarium. In this case I would like to mention that if you start a new clan your Holmgang level restarts and would face easier competion and still receive your bonuses. At lower levels you may not face the 3T+ powerhouse until you are ready.

Another suggestion would be to defend the forts until which time the island troops are destory and pull yours. This way you get the shards necessary to grow stronger without the cost of troop loss. I also think that it was admirable that your opponent recognized the mismatch yet was willing to work with you.

I would also like to point out that being a L39 town does have its advantages too. At L39 you do not have to compete against mega L40 towns for personal checkpoints. It is a two-edge sword in the fight with influence and strength.

I also think that because this game is multi-level that fighting take places on several levels and we are not always capable to fight in JOT or Asgard as others do. We are learning that the true value of this game the friends we make not the goals we will never reach or attain.

Many L40 towns are very active with what we call the "grind" which strengthens their towns through town skins, gear, gems and achievements without raising their influence. Currently their are not check and balances for this in the game and has produced lopsided match ups. There are no easy answers but I hope that this helps in suggesting ways that you can still find enjoyment in the game and be victorious.


I appreciate your comments. Then again starting a new clan would mean a new Stronghold, and given the fact that we also play with a limited budget, there's not going to be much enthousiasm to do that. 

As for friendship, I live in an awkward time zone and I generally play when people sleep, so I am definitely missing out. The advantage is that even in the powerkingdom I am residing in, I end up completing most event-checkpoint. All but invaders which is a rip-off anyway.

I'm in my sixth year in this game and I consider myself a good tactical player. I keep looking for ways to thwart stronger enemies. Unfortunately the difference between levels is growing bigger all the time. I haven't been spending money lately and still wondering if it is time to leave.

3 июль 2022, 14:5303.07.22
09.09.18
8

Iron Shaman sent you a private msg.

3 июль 2022, 16:1203.07.22
06.04.18
572

Reading what you both have to say makes me think that there is quite a lot of fun for you in the game, despite the frustrations which you have both aired on this board.

I will hazard a suggestion.  I play without spending money.  I cannot imagine playing chess if my opponent or I could pay a sum of money and remove the queen from the board.  Similarly bridge would be a total waste of time if the cards you are dealt could be changed on payment of a fee.  And so for every game.  Of course playing this game without spending money limits what you can do.  I have spent very little time in Jot and it will be some time before the tiny clan in which I play reaches 1T influence let alone 3T.  We have yet to tackle even a tier 1 Tower in Fury (although that one is a short to medium term aim) Such targets as I set for myself as regards advancing town and army are modest and take a lot of patience to reach.

And here is the point.  I do not suffer from the sort of impatience which seems to be a substantial driving force among those who do spend money.

I can well understand that constantly making progress offers satisfaction but it also stokes up the desire for more, and more rapid, progress.

So my suggestion is to try playing for a month or two spending nothing.  Adjust sights on what is achieveable and what not.  Focus on the fun of developing tactical and strategic skills and on enjoying the company of fellow gamers.

And I wonder whether that might not revive interest.  It will certainly allow for a new perspective and, possibly, new answers to the problems of playing in an environment where it is not possible to be competitive with high spenders.

3 июль 2022, 16:2403.07.22
05.12.17
13
John

Reading what you both have to say makes me think that there is quite a lot of fun for you in the game, despite the frustrations which you have both aired on this board.

I will hazard a suggestion.  I play without spending money.  I cannot imagine playing chess if my opponent or I could pay a sum of money and remove the queen from the board.  Similarly bridge would be a total waste of time if the cards you are dealt could be changed on payment of a fee.  And so for every game.  Of course playing this game without spending money limits what you can do.  I have spent very little time in Jot and it will be some time before the tiny clan in which I play reaches 1T influence let alone 3T.  We have yet to tackle even a tier 1 Tower in Fury (although that one is a short to medium term aim) Such targets as I set for myself as regards advancing town and army are modest and take a lot of patience to reach.

And here is the point.  I do not suffer from the sort of impatience which seems to be a substantial driving force among those who do spend money.

I can well understand that constantly making progress offers satisfaction but it also stokes up the desire for more, and more rapid, progress.

So my suggestion is to try playing for a month or two spending nothing.  Adjust sights on what is achieveable and what not.  Focus on the fun of developing tactical and strategic skills and on enjoying the company of fellow gamers.

And I wonder whether that might not revive interest.  It will certainly allow for a new perspective and, possibly, new answers to the problems of playing in an environment where it is not possible to be competitive with high spenders.

Easy. As I mentioned in my reply to pool noodle I havent been spending money for months. I did spend a lot last year though, just to get where I am now. I am still having fun and we're still winning cvc. The thing is that from a certain level, you get a lot of stuff that keeps you going. Surely I reap the free stuff as well. That is the reason that I am still playing. If this would require a monthly fee I would have quit the game by now.

3 июль 2022, 16:5603.07.22
30.07.19
9

5 horas despues de anunciarse Holmgang ya no hay manera de participar, están todas las franjas horarias completas. Acabo de echar un vistazo y no veo acticidad por ningún lado, varias islas vacias y solo unos pocos jugadores sin escudo esperando que alguien les ataque para recolectar almas. Podeis poner remedio a esto?

3 июль 2022, 19:5603.07.22
3 июль 2022, 19:56(отредактировано)
11.01.17
4649
Iron_Shaman

That would be the most naive solution. Your influence rating is broken, Ivar. That means your game is broken. Your fix is like changing the tires of your car because you ran out of oil in your engine. If you fix as I mentioned above, the opponents assignation functionality doesn't need to tampered with. What makes it so difficult for you guys to admit that level 40's are overpowered? Is it really greed or sheer stupidity?

Iron_Shaman, please specify the particular changes you would like to see in the Rankings functionality, I will surely forward all suggestions to the developers🙂



 

3 июль 2022, 19:5903.07.22
3 июль 2022, 20:01(отредактировано)
11.01.17
4649
Ñam

5 horas despues de anunciarse Holmgang ya no hay manera de participar, están todas las franjas horarias completas. Acabo de echar un vistazo y no veo acticidad por ningún lado, varias islas vacias y solo unos pocos jugadores sin escudo esperando que alguien les ataque para recolectar almas. Podeis poner remedio a esto?

Hi Ñam, if a group contains an odd number of participants, the Clan with the lowest Influence will be left without an opponent and will miss this Competition.

Please try to apply to participate in Holmgang a bit earlier next time to find an opponent and take part in it😇

4 июль 2022, 08:4604.07.22
4 июль 2022, 08:49(отредактировано)
05.12.17
13
Ivar Marksman

Iron_Shaman, please specify the particular changes you would like to see in the Rankings functionality, I will surely forward all suggestions to the developers🙂



 

Rankings functionality. I assume you mean the influence based ranking you use to assign opponents to clans/kingdoms for all battle events. I think I mentioned it above very clearly: add 1T influence to every lvl 40. This is best done when they upgrade their Oracle building to lvl 40.

By doing so clans without a lvl 40 at least have a fighting chance against their opponent. In case both clans have a lvl 40, it makes no difference. The stronger the clans, the difference becomes less important. Younger kingdoms also will have a fighting chance whereas now they are cannonfodder for the more developped kingdoms.

1 trillion, why so much? Because any lvl 40 that has their lvl 40 knowledge upgrades (or just part of them) is totally overpowered against any other lvl player. It is impossible to win an attack on their Siege tower with 2  and even 3 lvl 39 towns. Defending towers against a lvl 40 is always a total loss. You might as well just dismiss your troops. 

1T is an estimate, but it won't be too far off. Playtesting will confirm the eventual amount. 

4 июль 2022, 11:4904.07.22
11.01.17
4649
Iron_Shaman

Rankings functionality. I assume you mean the influence based ranking you use to assign opponents to clans/kingdoms for all battle events. I think I mentioned it above very clearly: add 1T influence to every lvl 40. This is best done when they upgrade their Oracle building to lvl 40.

By doing so clans without a lvl 40 at least have a fighting chance against their opponent. In case both clans have a lvl 40, it makes no difference. The stronger the clans, the difference becomes less important. Younger kingdoms also will have a fighting chance whereas now they are cannonfodder for the more developped kingdoms.

1 trillion, why so much? Because any lvl 40 that has their lvl 40 knowledge upgrades (or just part of them) is totally overpowered against any other lvl player. It is impossible to win an attack on their Siege tower with 2  and even 3 lvl 39 towns. Defending towers against a lvl 40 is always a total loss. You might as well just dismiss your troops. 

1T is an estimate, but it won't be too far off. Playtesting will confirm the eventual amount. 

I got this point, Iron_Shaman, and have forwarded your comment to the devs😇

Thanks a lot for the honest feedback!

7 июль 2022, 15:1507.07.22
05.12.17
13
Ivar Marksman

I got this point, Iron_Shaman, and have forwarded your comment to the devs😇

Thanks a lot for the honest feedback!

Maybe I should point out some advantages of a more fair fight :

1. Confidence. We can do this. In a balanced fight there is more motivation.

2. More risk in battle. If you know there is a FAIR chance in beating an opponent, you are more likely to pick a fight or take a challenge.

3. When weaker kingdoms start to realise they have better chances, more people will play.

4. Less 'no shows' in Holmgang and cvc

8 июль 2022, 11:1108.07.22
11.01.17
4649
Iron_Shaman

Maybe I should point out some advantages of a more fair fight :

1. Confidence. We can do this. In a balanced fight there is more motivation.

2. More risk in battle. If you know there is a FAIR chance in beating an opponent, you are more likely to pick a fight or take a challenge.

3. When weaker kingdoms start to realise they have better chances, more people will play.

4. Less 'no shows' in Holmgang and cvc

Thank you for the detail! 👍

30 июль 2022, 18:2030.07.22
22.12.17
29
Ivar Marksman

Hi Ñam, if a group contains an odd number of participants, the Clan with the lowest Influence will be left without an opponent and will miss this Competition.

Please try to apply to participate in Holmgang a bit earlier next time to find an opponent and take part in it😇

 Please try to apply to participate in Holmgang a bit earlier next time to find an opponent and take part in it😇 So you want European players to wake in the middle of the night to try and get a slot????  You do not have enough spots for the clans who want to take part, that is the problem.  Also change the time the event is announced, give other time zones a chance to get if first. This will never change though, you have had complaints about this since Holmgang came out and have done nothing. You have also had complaints about other event start time, and done nothing. The mods saying we will pass on requests means nothing, because nothing ever changes. And you wonder why the players numbers and your rating is going down.. 


31 июль 2022, 06:3731.07.22
10.07.18
5

holmgang needs to be shut down.........there are no rules to say that you have to wake up in the night just to participate.......