Arms Guild Level two and three

7 Replies
User
16 August, 2019, 3:54 PM UTC
I think an update of the arms guild is long over due, All buildings in the stronghold can be upgraded to level 3 apart from the arms guild, My suggestion is for a level two arms guild, once upgraded to level two the cost of the resources to learn new drafts would be reduced as well as the amount of coal and the time to study the draft would also be reduced as well as this once a clan has a level 2 stronghold they would also have the ability to make the Armour of the north gear in the forge which has the best resource yielding stats in the whole game, This Armour is only available for brand new players in the game to help them reach palace 21 fast as it has free boosting up to about 4 days or so. It is only available for the new players threw bank offers which is extremely unfair as once they level up to palace 21 they will have a permanent advantage when resource yielding versus the older players who had to craft the centurions set along with hakkons boots which rss yielding stats are about half of what the armour of the north set is. After the arms guild is upgraded to level 2 it could then be upgraded to level three as long as your stronghold is level 3 of course, A level 3 stronghold would reduce the costs even further for learning new drafts for resources and coal as well as an even greater reduction in time for each new draft. Then the cherry on the top of having a level 3 arms guild would be the ability to craft the kings gear in the forge which at the moment is exclusively available  for wining Jotunheim.
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User
16 August, 2019, 5:33 PM UTC

Whether there should be ugrades to the arms guild or not is another matter,but  the rest of your suggestion sounds more like a' what about me proposal', rather than a what about everyone idea.

The updates that occurred after palace 21, have  both lengthened and widened the game considerably, such that new players could look at it and think why bother to even start, let alone to continue,its such a daunting task to contemplate being able to compete.

It is not true that the gear of the north is resevered for new players via the bank,it was subsequently offered to more established players a while back.

I thought it was a one time offer,but its still there.

The effects are probably more significant in a new account where 21% yielding boost sounds considerable, but it doesnt seem to make that much difference in an established account,a few seconds at best,correct me if I am wrong,if you have your hero set accordingly.


The gear of the north is contraversial,but it strikes me as being both an attempt to attract new players to the game, and keep them, in order to make more money.   The whole set doesnt come cheaply.

Dont forget new players did not have the advantage,of being able to access the centurion or the barbarian when they withdrew them, and only now see them less frequently than the other invaders.

And what about the fact standard invaders lairs do not remain for nearly as long as they used to?

Ubers are not the prospect they once were either, their lairs continue for only 6 hours,and contain much less resources than previously, which makes both these less attractive targets and effectively more costly to kill.

Again, one of the incentives for winning Jotunheim.is as you say, the kings gear, well  few people can win this,few people have,so its not so much a big deal to the majority of players.

If you give the abilty to everyone who is fortunate to be well advanced enough, are you just removing an incentive for playing in Jotunheim, and just making it harder for the players who are not as fortunate as you are with already having a well advanced stronghold?

All changes in the game would not matter if each server was a closed system, but because they are interactive, newcomers are always going to be disadvantaged against players of long standing.


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User
16 August, 2019, 6:59 PM UTC
I have never been offered the north gear on bank offers only on my alt which is level 19, I believe the gear of the north was offered to older accounts but only if it was still below palace 21, As for the king's  gear most players play for soul shards and the slim chance of being crowned king of jotunheim, I have noticed that very few kings even bother to use the kings gear as they use pop gear and troop specific gear for fighting with, jotunheim has been going for a while now and I don't think it would reduce the amount of players that take part in jotunheim if the King's gear was available to all players, They could make the king's gear super hard to make but at least other players who were not in the top 10 clans in the game would have a chance to get it, Also the clan chief is the only player who receives a piece of the Kings gear as a prize the rest in the wining clan get nothing. Before king's gear and armour of the north gear were released all armour was available to make, Yes a lot of the new gear is not easy to make but at least you have the chance to actually make it, All armour should be available to all player's not just a select few. And the post is not a what about me proposal there are a lot of players in the game that are very unhappy about not be able to access the north gear, And the main reason I suggested an arms guild update is a lot of the smaller clans struggle to learn the new drafts as the amount of time it takes to learn them is high not to mention the coal and rss, If you are in a big spending clan no problem but not all players are.
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User
19 August, 2019, 4:54 PM UTC

Initially I was also one of those that thought it unfair to give new players what seemed to be such a big headstart by offering them,'Equipment of the North'.

Now my judgement has been modified, I am not so sure that its such of a big deal.

I have a suspicion the  benefits are more significant to lower level accounts.

They first offered the gear to me,not on this account,,around the middle of April,

I thought it was likely a one off offer, that it was expensive. and initially for the most part I ignored it,I didnt even notice that it was Legendary equiment. 


Recently,thinking that a yielding speed mark up of 21% would help me greatly in finishing of a level, and a tile before the time expired ,I bought a helmet, and found it hardly made any difference.It would need more data to confirm this but that would be complicated, time consuming, and expensive to accomplish.

However here is a quick example.The times are rough as it is difficult to catch the exact times .

No helmet                            yield time  1.36 secs

North helmet unusual gems yield time 1.30 secs.

Other helmet  usual gems   yield tiime 1.35 secs

I will leave you to decide if this is significant enough to matter.


I know you decided to open a new account  though its tempting to do likewise ,am I that curious, do I need another Kingdom to deal with?


Excepting the axe, by some unknown criteria,through the bank,they now offer this equipment to established players,its possible that they will later make it available in the forge, they will need to come up with the materials to make it, and probably less of a problem, rearrange the forge.

I wonder how many will bother if the option is opened.




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User
20 August, 2019, 4:46 PM UTC

WDYWTNTF said:


Initially I was also one of those that thought it unfair to give new players what seemed to be such a big headstart by offering them,'Equipment of the North'.

Now my judgement has been modified, I am not so sure that its such of a big deal.

I have a suspicion the  benefits are more significant to lower level accounts.

They first offered the gear to me,not on this account,,around the middle of April,

I thought it was likely a one off offer, that it was expensive. and initially for the most part I ignored it,I didnt even notice that it was Legendary equiment. 


Recently,thinking that a yielding speed mark up of 21% would help me greatly in finishing of a level, and a tile before the time expired ,I bought a helmet, and found it hardly made any difference.It would need more data to confirm this but that would be complicated, time consuming, and expensive to accomplish.

However here is a quick example.The times are rough as it is difficult to catch the exact times .

No helmet                            yield time  1.36 secs

North helmet unusual gems yield time 1.30 secs.

Other helmet  usual gems   yield tiime 1.35 secs

I will leave you to decide if this is significant enough to matter.


I know you decided to open a new account  though its tempting to do likewise ,am I that curious, do I need another Kingdom to deal with?


Excepting the axe, by some unknown criteria,through the bank,they now offer this equipment to established players,its possible that they will later make it available in the forge, they will need to come up with the materials to make it, and probably less of a problem, rearrange the forge.

I wonder how many will bother if the option is opened.




Thanks for the info WYDWTNTF  The only time I have known the axe to be offed to players is when the Palace is still below Level 10 I believe as it gives the least amount of time on free boosting as the other pieces, The price of the axe is by far the cheapest onlly £1.79 My alt was level 17 when the account was offered the north sent minus the axe and the amulets which I think the amulet is only offered once you have purchased the other pieces are when you have a higher palace level but I'm not 100% about how the amulets bank offers work. I did a test my self with 5 of the 6 centurion equipment plus Hakkons boots which has greater rss yielding stats plus capacity which the centurion's calceus does not have, The first test I did was with no Hero on a full level 6 tile, The yielding time was 3 hours and 26 mins The second test was hero With no armour but with yielding and capacity Hero set, The time for this was 1 Hour and 36 mins, And lastly Same Hero set but with Centurions Gear and Hakkon's Boots, The time for this was 1 Hour 11 Mins.







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User
20 August, 2019, 7:22 PM UTC

Thanks for your thanks and input.

I have a fairly new account that I've not bothered with pushing past Palace 4, it wasnt offered the axe.



There are several things to consider when sending out marches to collect from tiles.


Do you want to....


Take less risk?

Increase capacity?

Go and return quickly?

They are interrelated

With reference to your tests .


Its useful that you included the screen shots.

I notice that they are full tiles, but they are not the same kind, and the amount of troops vary.So you are taking the time to empty a full tile ( which is constant for any type of resource of the same level) is this the games defintion of yielding speed? Or is it something else?

There are always different ways of assessing something.

I did not do as you did.

I sent out a fixed number of troops and recorded the time for collection.


So the way you did your test  and assessment of priorities is different to mine.

I would suggest ideally that one should conduct any test under the same conditions.

My test and weighting failed to do this, in so far as the gems in the two helmets were not the same class,and in one case it included a capacity gem which meant it increased the time spent on the tile because of this, however the mathematical adjustment  made little difference  on such a small quantity of resources.

There was no changing of Hero skills or other equiment.

So our tests are not really comparable. 

I was just seeing how much difference the helmet of the north  made over no helmet or a standard helmet (no capacity or yielding speed)

I came to the conclusion hardly any.I will have to retest over a longer timescale (I had just wanted a quick assessment for my post)

You are comparing no hero with something I didn't understand{The second test was hero With no armour but with yielding and capacity Hero set}, and Centurions + Hakkons boots

However,what you can say is if you use your best set you can save 25 minutes, is that significant enough?

What you really need is one of the north pieces to see if you can save any more time, then work out if it was worth the expense or the hassle if it had to be forged,in much in the same way as, was it worth the time and expense of getting the centurions gear and Hakkons boots.

The other thing you have to take into consideration when determing the worth of something is firstly the other benefits it brings, the pieces of the north give you time boosts , but in the early part of the game they could rob you of clan loyalty points, which may be of more worth.

Just as the test i did works for me,the test that you did,only works for those with your set up, and a new starter isnt likely to have that, it takes a long time to get the hero level up and the skills to fully open capacity and yielding, and the beginner is hardly likely to have the best gear or gems or a shaman, so 21%  yielding speed( whatever that means)is  probably going to be  a big boost in collecting resources from tiles.

Not so much when your heros going towards level 70 and the clans  hypher farming and banking and doesnt really need to yield.



Edit

{The second test was hero With no armour but with yielding and capacity Hero set}

I keep gong back and forth to this to try and be certain what it means.

Now I am back to my first thought of... the hero has no armour but has hero skills assigned to prioritise capacity and yielding speed.

I.e. The second test was hero with no armour but with yielding and capacity Hero SKILLS set . sometimes I was thinking you swopped  one Hero  set for another Hero set.

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User
21 August, 2019, 3:02 AM UTC
Each test I did was with a full tile, I sent the exact number of troops to empty the tile in full, it takes the same length of time to empty a full food tile as it would to empty a full stone or lumber tile the only difference is you have to send more troops to empty a food tile as it contains more rss, A full level 6 food tile contains 1,296m food where as a full lumber or stone tile contains 1.0368m,  as I said the length of time to collect 1.0368m stone or lumber is exactly the same amount of time it is to collect 1.296m food. so if your armour and hero set also have capacity you would be able to send less troops to empty the tile in full. When I conducted the test I used the same hero set on both occasions, one where hero had centurions gear and hakkon's boots and one with no armour at all but with the same hero set with max capacity and max rss yielding stats. The Armour of the north set amulets do not have rss yielding stats so only 4 out of the 6 would increase rss yielding which would be 84%, Spoils of war knowledge I already gives 66% to rss yielding and hero skills for rss yielding to max give an even greater increase so the 4 pieces from the north set as you said may not increase an advanced player's yielding time by that much and also it does not have capacity like hakkon's boots and most of the centurions gear does so maybe it is not that great to an advanced player but I suppose it is just the fact that I do  not have the option to make it, I would like to compare it to my centurion's gear and Hakkon's boots but I suspect the difference would be marginal at my level but as I said it would be nice to have the option to make it if I wanted as all sets I craft have the best stats for what I want to use them for, That is also one of the reason's why I wanted king's gear as it has the greatest training speed in the game even more than the special equipment for troop training but that is another story.
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User
21 August, 2019, 6:20 PM UTC

I understand  your point of view, about not having the ability to forge every piece of equipment there is, and knew what you say about how tiles empty.

You're happy ,I'm happy, we work things out differently, one of the reasons is, I do not have the luxury of the centurions set and Hakkons boots, or the ability to sit on a tile till it empties.

Which is another point, a new starter with be in more  frantic environment and without a no tile hitting policy.

 I remain ignorant as to what  officially is 'resource yielding speed'

Is there more than 1, or is there something in the program that lets it now which level of tile you have landed on?

I cannot find the definition,

nor what the base rate is, so it makes it difficult to calculate any  increase in benefit before hand.

For simplicity sakes, if you were travelling at 100. and had an icrease of 25%, and you only ended up travelling at 101  you would have reason enough to ask how come, and complain.



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