Broken BG Proof

65 Replies
TheBeast
15 April, 2017, 11:29 AM UTC

I have been in contact with Plarium for 8 months regarding BG issues with no resolution (Support, CM, and Oberon).

- My account has suffered 240m resource losses.

- I have loaded 150m resource since my last payout. My Max lvl BG is 97 (which has just under a 100m banking value). I failed today to get a payout on a lvl 90 (80m banking value) which I am twice banked for. 

- It is clear I have suffered a second catastrophic bank failure

- In Oct last year the BG's dropped 100m of resource from my bank  

- This account should have 45m-50m power troops on it, it has nearly run out of troops now


The difference between this and other BG's issues raised is that I have a pefect log of BG activity covering my entire playing history. Where Plarium have records their records match mine and confirm my data is correct.

I can say without doubt that:

- BG's are BUGGED.

- The BG log in this post absolutely, without doubt, proves it.

- Plarium have refused to do anything about it.

- I am not the only person to encounter or suffer this bug

I am thought the it appears the only person who has kept factually evidence to conclusively prove my account has suffered catastrophic error. 

It is with regret that Plarium have not resolved and I have been forced to expose this publicly, My only hope is that the community as a whole can now put enough pressure on Plarium to do the right thing. This isn't a question, or a possibility, the log provides complete and unquestionable factual evidence that there is a problem. 



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TheBeast
15 April, 2017, 11:32 AM UTC

The Full Log can be found here:

The Full BG Log


- Each BG is recorded on 2 rows in pairs. 1 row for the loading 1 row for the payout.

- Loading in is record as positives, payouts out as negatives

- The cumulative result of BG's for the entire history of the account is shown on each row

- The 241m positive cumulative total means the account has lost 241m in BGs


The Major Loss Moments:

Recent History:

- Recent history from BG 634 to 649 shows 150m of resource loading (on top of the previous lost resource).

- BG 645, lvl 96, avg banking value of 96m failed to payout despite 113m having been recently loaded (ignore all bank b4 BG 634)

- Subsequently 2 lvl 90's (av banking value of 80m) failed to payout, the second of which had over 150m of just recently loading. So it was virtually twice banked and failed to payout

Original Loss in Oct 16:

- Problems started between BG's 529 and 548

- Just under 200m was required to be loaded before a full payout occurred.

- Since then have achieved payouts that have cleared the cumulative bank to just under 100m but never a hint of ever getting the 100m back

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Juglar del Viento
Moderator
17 April, 2017, 10:20 AM UTC

Dear Lord

first of all nice work done tracing ur bg history

unfortunately i have renounce to continue doing bgs as the moment the system, at least at high levels, is not so clear and seems its difficult to try to get a big payout (too many looses for trying to get the usual payout of a level). if i hit some are arround levels 40-50 and still on those levels the payouts are also impredectibles even killing the bg in one shot.

so at this moment i cant help you with these possible issues and the only thing i can say to keep tracing ur looses and payouts to increase the possible proofs

sorry for this

Regards
Resistance Is Futile
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Lord Mark
17 April, 2017, 11:39 AM UTC

I am at max lvl at BG.

I am trying for few mounts to get a reward on a high lvl...but no luck
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BiohazarD
Moderator
17 April, 2017, 8:36 PM UTC
Lord Mark said:

I am at max lvl at BG.

I am trying for few mounts to get a reward on a high lvl...but no luck
If you're at level 170 it takes a lot of troops to get a payout. 
Any opinions expressed by me are my own and do not necessarily represent the opinions of or constitute official statements by Plarium.
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djmoody
23 April, 2017, 10:56 PM UTC
This is hugely important. I am suprised so few ppl have commented.
Everyone has a right to an opinion. No one has a right to their opinion being respected by other if it can't be backed up with rational and logic explanation
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Stewart
24 April, 2017, 12:15 AM UTC

djmoody said:


This is hugely important. I am suprised so few ppl have commented.

Most have given up bashing their head against the wall.


No matter how much proof you give them they will continue to state the BG are working fine, The grass is purple, That water can be used to dry yourself of after a nice swim in the dirt, And that the sky is tartan.


Its their game and if they say that 6 is more than 15, then 6 is more than 15.
Noodle maker extreme
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Solidarius
24 April, 2017, 6:37 AM UTC

Stewart_KT1 said:


djmoody said:


This is hugely important. I am suprised so few ppl have commented.

Most have given up bashing their head against the wall.


No matter how much proof you give them they will continue to state the BG are working fine, The grass is purple, That water can be used to dry yourself of after a nice swim in the dirt, And that the sky is tartan.


Its their game and if they say that 6 is more than 15, then 6 is more than 15.

???? just because a few people at very high lvl BG's cant get payouts does not mean they are "broken"...


I feel bad for the OP, and anyone else who gets there "bank" destroyed/bugged/broken ect 


I am not saying that BG's are great or profitable but they do work for me and have been since I started playing...
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Oracle
24 April, 2017, 8:16 AM UTC

djmoody said:


This is hugely important. I am suprised so few ppl have commented.

Because they know that should they comment, their comment will be ignored by the poster and ''BG experts''. 

the fact is our current understanding of BG is obsolete.Problem is people are too afraid to talk because anyone who has ever proposed a different method of doing BG has been shunned. 

So they choose to keep quite, because their knowledge will result in embarrassment and shame.
Biohazard has killed the forum.
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Juglar del Viento
Moderator
24 April, 2017, 11:37 AM UTC

Oracle said:


djmoody said:


This is hugely important. I am suprised so few ppl have commented.

Because they know that should they comment, their comment will be ignored by the poster and ''BG experts''. 

the fact is our current understanding of BG is obsolete.Problem is people are too afraid to talk because anyone who has ever proposed a different method of doing BG has been shunned. 

So they choose to keep quite, because their knowledge will result in embarrassment and shame.

dear lords

i would like do a reflexion and leave a though here. Could all we be wrong about the system ???...in fact still system requires banking but we should investigate if our numbers require some kind of adaptition to this system. think about it and leave ur thoughts here


about ur comment Oracle, i think people is not afraid or propose other method of banking. i think people dont tell absolutely anything if they know some points and dont want to share. so they prefer stay quite and keeps this system working for their adavantage.

Regards
Resistance Is Futile
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Alina Bright
Community Manager
24 April, 2017, 4:09 PM UTC

Lords, let me remind you that Battlegrounds are one of the gameplay elements, it's an optional daily in-game activity, in which our players can, but not obliged to participate. Players destroy Battlegrounds and receive rewards for their successfull missions. You can try to figure out what's the most effective way to destroy Balur's Units, and what determines the size of your Rewards. But it's not a required condition for Battlegrounds raiding.

All Units (including different modifications) count when you raid Battlegrounds. However, please keep in mind that the actual Unit value may differ from your expectations and the info provided by other players in different spreadsheets. 

As I mentioned in my previous replies, we haven't changed anything in Batllegrounds mechanics and there are no issues with them. If you find your results dissaponting, you can concentate on PvP battles instead.



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Jezebel
24 April, 2017, 7:31 PM UTC

Juglar del Viento said:


Oracle said:


djmoody said:


This is hugely important. I am suprised so few ppl have commented.

Because they know that should they comment, their comment will be ignored by the poster and ''BG experts''. 

the fact is our current understanding of BG is obsolete.Problem is people are too afraid to talk because anyone who has ever proposed a different method of doing BG has been shunned. 

So they choose to keep quite, because their knowledge will result in embarrassment and shame.

dear lords

i would like do a reflexion and leave a though here. Could all we be wrong about the system ???...in fact still system requires banking but we should investigate if our numbers require some kind of adaptition to this system. think about it and leave ur thoughts here


about ur comment Oracle, i think people is not afraid or propose other method of banking. i think people dont tell absolutely anything if they know some points and dont want to share. so they prefer stay quite and keeps this system working for their adavantage.

Regards

the banking system will work somewhat but the bg's have been messed with by Plarium to the point that no one wants to risk a large army to try to do them


i liked doing bg's but I have not done them for a very long time - fact we used to know and understand the bg bank when it worked but now you have to muck about a lot if you use the bank system and you don't always get your dues - what happened with Beast is very unfortunate and should not be blatantly ignored as it has been 


because my bg bank is in a huge deficit I generally just toss troops in when we have a league bg tournament to make some points for the league - BUT because of how things have gone and that many suspect the banks were messed with I have no idea if I am getting any credit for the resources I am putting in that I will eventually try to take out
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djmoody
24 April, 2017, 10:31 PM UTC

Eugenia Misura said:


Lords, let me remind you that Battlegrounds are one of the gameplay elements, it's an optional daily in-game activity, in which our players can, but not obliged to participate. Players destroy Battlegrounds and receive rewards for their successfull missions. You can try to figure out what's the most effective way to destroy Balur's Units, and what determines the size of your Rewards. But it's not a required condition for Battlegrounds raiding.

All Units (including different modifications) count when you raid Battlegrounds. However, please keep in mind that the actual Unit value may differ from your expectations and the info provided by other players in different spreadsheets. 

As I mentioned in my previous replies, we haven't changed anything in Batllegrounds mechanics and there are no issues with them. If you find your results dissaponting, you can concentate on PvP battles instead.



So nice statement.

Now review the log provided instead of posting a copy and paste response, head in sand that there is no problem.

It's quite simple. If you can explain how someone can lose 250m resources when their max BG is 97 which has a an average banking value of just under 100m then you get to make your statement with credibility. 

Losing 2.5 times the banking value of your max lvl BG should be impossible,

Losing 100m resource at level 97 BG's should also be impossible.

The BG's then went back to paying out at appropriate levels of banking for a couple of months. The 100m was clearly just gone. Clearing top levels is showing no payouts, so the game clearly doesn't see any bank - again the 100m is gone. 

Over 100 BG's have been cleared without the bank clearing over months. It's never coming out.

The pure denial of obvious facts is sickening.


Everyone has a right to an opinion. No one has a right to their opinion being respected by other if it can't be backed up with rational and logic explanation
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Oracle
25 April, 2017, 8:32 AM UTC
Eugenia Misura said:

Lords, let me remind you that Battlegrounds are one of the gameplay elements, it's an optional daily in-game activity, in which our players can, but not obliged to participate. Players destroy Battlegrounds and receive rewards for their successfull missions. You can try to figure out what's the most effective way to destroy Balur's Units, and what determines the size of your Rewards. But it's not a required condition for Battlegrounds raiding.

All Units (including different modifications) count when you raid Battlegrounds. However, please keep in mind that the actual Unit value may differ from your expectations and the info provided by other players in different spreadsheets. 

As I mentioned in my previous replies, we haven't changed anything in Batllegrounds mechanics and there are no issues with them. If you find your results dissaponting, you can concentate on PvP battles instead.



My Lady can you please  expand on the highlighted sentence. 
Biohazard has killed the forum.
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Oracle
25 April, 2017, 8:35 AM UTC

djmoody said:

So nice statement.

Now review the log provided instead of posting a copy and paste response, head in sand that there is no problem.

It's quite simple. If you can explain how someone can lose 250m resources when their max BG is 97 which has a an average banking value of just under 100m then you get to make your statement with credibility. 

Losing 2.5 times the banking value of your max lvl BG should be impossible,

Losing 100m resource at level 97 BG's should also be impossible.

The BG's then went back to paying out at appropriate levels of banking for a couple of months. The 100m was clearly just gone. Clearing top levels is showing no payouts, so the game clearly doesn't see any bank - again the 100m is gone. 

Over 100 BG's have been cleared without the bank clearing over months. It's never coming out.

The pure denial of obvious facts is sickening.


Why do you think that someone should not be able to lose ''250m 250m resources when their max BG is 97''?

I think expanding on that question will enable to ''properly'' respond to your question.

Biohazard has killed the forum.
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Juglar del Viento
Moderator
25 April, 2017, 9:45 AM UTC

Oracle said:


Why do you think that someone should not be able to lose ''250m 250m resources when their max BG is 97''?

I think expanding on that question will enable to ''properly'' respond to your question.

Dear Lords

i think i told this in other post. well is totally known that the program used to calculate uses differents amounts than us.

till now, the difference between that amounts is not so important as the moment the amounts we use are pretty near to make us have a clear idea when a bg can be ready for a payout. what i mean is for example:

we use resources (the total sum of iron+gold+food) to load a bg level 50 and for this we use arround 14,5M of resources  and we could receive as a payout arround that amount (sometimes less sometimes more)

for the progam, if it uses resources (i think so but in a different way i dont know) lets say that that level 50 needs for example 12M of 'its' resources or the amount the program takes to bank but when that bg pays it payouts is arround 'its' 12M it cost to load. this means that although we use different way and amounts to trace the bank the way we used to do is more or less equivalent as the real program does. to this we have to add the variables u need in a bg to be ready for the payout (not only load it properly ) and the ramdom component (???).

well in real the amount we use for example one paladian is about 520 of resources. but really the bank of balur says (for example 328)

this mean for example in a bg with we have to load 65500 of resources to get a payout. we send 200 paladians kill 65.500 of resources and get the payout. for the real program we have banked arround 104000 and got the payout so more or less the way is equivalent


now lets go to summer of 2015 when some iluminated brains gift us a mini reward although if ur bank was not ready for the payout

the banking system we used were the same and it still worked although u have to addapt the loosess-winnigs. the yellow barring still worked and it was even better

why? easy, the minipayouts were arround the 10% of the big payout of that bg gave if ur bank were ready. What happened then?

well you can barrell 11 levels 100 with only one balur troop inside. kill one and u got the big payout of that 100 and then clear the other 10 what means u receive another big payout in minirewads killing only the troop inside and 0 looses

i think along that months some or another big illuminated brain thought this was an unfair method. Well, really is an unfair method???

lets see: you begin with ur bank at 0. you construct ur bank spending 132M of resources loading a 100 and barrelling 10 levels 100 more (well really i think u spend more but set u spend arround 132M) then u get ur big payout (arround 132M) and get 10 minirewads spending 0 getting i all that 10 a reward equivalent to another big payout (132M)

ur bank goes from 0 to 132M get the payout ur bank goes to 0 again and getting 10 minirewards ur bank goes to -132M !!!!

is this really and unfair method ??? next time u have to bank the double to get another level 100 payout

but some genius said this is unfair. ok well

arrived summer 2016 with this great idea on mind and set no no this is not good and let change to less minirewards and no bank if bg is not totally killed.

in this point all is messed and lost, we dont know which amounts banks and which not and although the first months of this system it could seems u still could have a method after some months the payouts were worse and near to imposible to know when u can receive a payout (more or less).

at this point and at this moment.

1.- i only build troops is only the strategy i have since the moment i dont have strategy to rebuild my army with bgs.

2.-i dont participate in pvps only to take a few points killing 40-50 troops to get zero loses on my side. i dont risk my army again if it is going to take me half a year or more to rebuid it

3.-i dont do bgs. or at leas high level bgs. i sometimes hit a 40-50 when i have troops. only build defense for that purpose and kill it after some weeks. so u can think i dont participate in bg tournaments neither. and believe me even in those levels is difficult to predict any kind of payout

4.-i stay stop. waiting for troops. my mines and houses fortunately produces for me to log in the mornings. do mi dailys and build troops. back at the night do the dailys and build troops. and so every day.


one real genius said once: sometimes to go ahead u must give two or three steps back to have a better perspective (i know it in spanish but i think the translate is pretty near to what i want to say)

Regards and hope u still continue this thread and giving ideas.






Resistance Is Futile
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Oracle
25 April, 2017, 12:05 PM UTC

Juglar del Viento said:



SNIP



Although I needed DJ Moody to answer the question, you did a pretty good job. And I think all we have to do now is to revise the method, and come up with a new plan.

If we managed to beat the system three times we can beat it for the forth time. 

You also gave a clear explanation and history of the bank system, changed that we made and how players beat the system. You were also honest to point out the flows in the system altogether. 

To put it into summary 

beginning of the game.

 system used yellow bar second biggest BG and clear the highest BG.

 - issue highest BG seems to be eating the reward

Someone produces a how to do BG video showing how to yellow bar, and get offensive or defensive rewards from BG. . People stopped going up in BG level. So they finished up all BG in a day. Plarium ups BG from +/-15 to 30 and a time travel to BG was reduced from over 30 min to 1 min. 

Take note  Till now the ''bank'' word was not in use. just yellow barring.

immediately after  BG were conquered and the word bank was used more. We understood BG, websites we up and running, that monitor and calculate bank, BG became a kill that X and you will get that Y reward. 

Then 2015 came, and the tax was invested, plarium mini-reward system

At these point word of 10%-15% tax came circulating out of a black-hole, most people didn't understand it so they ignored it and continued as usual. Since every BG always gave a maximum reward, and never a split reward when a bank was filled, one might undertand why would you ignore tax. 

-shortly rewards we split. 

remeber from now on a BG will not pay if its bank is not full. You get zero nada. these was a problem, players ran out of units if they did BG ''as intended'' without banking. So  plarium introduced the method to make sure players don't run out of troops. 

First global cheat, Maximum yellow baring, was then used to get arround the problem, e.g flooding your bank with a capital that far exceed your credit allowance. these way when those mini rewards came they came in full. These was a big problem, a player can start with 1 mil offense and build it to 6 mil by next week. 

Then something happened.I don't know what plarium did, they just said players where cheating and something about ''yellow baring will delay your rewards''. that was 2016. the rest is present tense history. 

Till now no new method was produced, any new system that upset the conservative is shunned an the inventor slandered. Some leagues produce new method but refuse to share, citing '' competative advantage and property of inventor / league''. Players insist they must still yellow bar BG, and they must still use the maximum banking method. Which explain my question to DJ moody.

Biohazard has killed the forum.
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Alina Bright
Community Manager
25 April, 2017, 1:16 PM UTC
Oracle said:

Eugenia Misura said:

Lords, let me remind you that Battlegrounds are one of the gameplay elements, it's an optional daily in-game activity, in which our players can, but not obliged to participate. Players destroy Battlegrounds and receive rewards for their successfull missions. You can try to figure out what's the most effective way to destroy Balur's Units, and what determines the size of your Rewards. But it's not a required condition for Battlegrounds raiding.

All Units (including different modifications) count when you raid Battlegrounds. However, please keep in mind that the actual Unit value may differ from your expectations and the info provided by other players in different spreadsheets. 

As I mentioned in my previous replies, we haven't changed anything in Batllegrounds mechanics and there are no issues with them. If you find your results dissaponting, you can concentate on PvP battles instead.



My Lady can you please  expand on the highlighted sentence. 
Hi! Sure. All Units, which you loose while attacking/defending Battlegrounds, are counted into your Rewards. No Units die for nothing, this is the basic point of getting Rewards. However, as you know, players created many different docs and spreadsheets, where they collected the data about "troops Resources cost in BGs" and so on, and some players expect that if they match such data with their strategy, they will definitely get the Reward. However, we have never provided players with the exact formula of such calculations. 
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Alina Bright
Community Manager
25 April, 2017, 1:18 PM UTC
djmoody said:

Eugenia Misura said:


Lords, let me remind you that Battlegrounds are one of the gameplay elements, it's an optional daily in-game activity, in which our players can, but not obliged to participate. Players destroy Battlegrounds and receive rewards for their successfull missions. You can try to figure out what's the most effective way to destroy Balur's Units, and what determines the size of your Rewards. But it's not a required condition for Battlegrounds raiding.

All Units (including different modifications) count when you raid Battlegrounds. However, please keep in mind that the actual Unit value may differ from your expectations and the info provided by other players in different spreadsheets. 

As I mentioned in my previous replies, we haven't changed anything in Batllegrounds mechanics and there are no issues with them. If you find your results dissaponting, you can concentate on PvP battles instead.



So nice statement.

Now review the log provided instead of posting a copy and paste response, head in sand that there is no problem.

It's quite simple. If you can explain how someone can lose 250m resources when their max BG is 97 which has a an average banking value of just under 100m then you get to make your statement with credibility. 

Losing 2.5 times the banking value of your max lvl BG should be impossible,

Losing 100m resource at level 97 BG's should also be impossible.

The BG's then went back to paying out at appropriate levels of banking for a couple of months. The 100m was clearly just gone. Clearing top levels is showing no payouts, so the game clearly doesn't see any bank - again the 100m is gone. 

Over 100 BG's have been cleared without the bank clearing over months. It's never coming out.

The pure denial of obvious facts is sickening.


Lord Djmoody, this statement is based on the fact that no issues with Battlegrounds haven't been detected. 
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djmoody
25 April, 2017, 8:28 PM UTC

Oracle said:


djmoody said:

So nice statement.

Now review the log provided instead of posting a copy and paste response, head in sand that there is no problem.

It's quite simple. If you can explain how someone can lose 250m resources when their max BG is 97 which has a an average banking value of just under 100m then you get to make your statement with credibility. 

Losing 2.5 times the banking value of your max lvl BG should be impossible,

Losing 100m resource at level 97 BG's should also be impossible.

The BG's then went back to paying out at appropriate levels of banking for a couple of months. The 100m was clearly just gone. Clearing top levels is showing no payouts, so the game clearly doesn't see any bank - again the 100m is gone. 

Over 100 BG's have been cleared without the bank clearing over months. It's never coming out.

The pure denial of obvious facts is sickening.


Why do you think that someone should not be able to lose ''250m 250m resources when their max BG is 97''?

I think expanding on that question will enable to ''properly'' respond to your question.


I explained that already - its a loss that is 2.5 times the max value of the top level BG.

You can't put that down to not loading properly or a "bit of a random" factor, when you are overload that much every BG's you touch should be paying out. The reason they aren't is obvious, the game hasn't registered the correct level of bank.

You can lose maybe a couple of % in BG's but without a bug it should be impossible to lose 250%. Worse than that it looks like 100m was lost in 1 day, more than the top level BG banking value at that time. That is impossible if operating normally.

Plarium can finally own up to there being a bug. Or if that is "working as intended" then no one should ever play BG's as Plarium is happy to operate a system that can steal entire armies in a day, regardless of whether BG's are appropriately loaded for payouts or not.

Everyone has a right to an opinion. No one has a right to their opinion being respected by other if it can't be backed up with rational and logic explanation
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