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Gaming mentality:

19 Replies
DJ Friction
9 October, 2016, 7:35 PM UTC

Hello! Unbeknownst to most of you I'd like to ask that you please pay attention to what I wish to talk about, rudely skipping a lengthy introduction other than that I'm not the more known 'Emperor Shin,' though it seems we got our names from the same source. :)


The 'gaming mentality' is what I'd like to address with this post, specifically one that relates to the grouping that naturally comes from creating and joining leagues as well as the fact that we're all individuals coming from all sorts of places meeting in a game like this and how that affects us. I'm sure you all understand by now that Balur isn't going to show his face (anytime soon anyway, I still keep some hope) and let us have a go at him personally, so we can only focus on each other playing this game.

Being no expert by any means, I still think it's safe to say that given the way we are all different as individuals, that it is a tall order to ask of everyone to get along. There is a mentality heading many players' actions in this game and it's really sad to see how prevalent it is. This is a game; Plarium has handed us an opportunity to play it, so why is it in the state it is? - Human nature would be the given answer and it probably has much to do with it, but I won't easily dismiss the potential solutions to making this game become a better experience even so.

I read once that someone complained about this game lacking a 'gentleman spirit' between us as gamers. I agree with that sentiment: Too quickly do we dismiss each other in favour of our league, friends and whatever priorities we have logging in to play the game. We simply forget that this is a game. People focus on spending money to simply beat down on each other and the strategic part of the game is lost. Your meeting with another person is diminished to "My league and everyone else outside of it" and that's a tragedy if anything.


I've been a Marshal for only a couple of months and I have gotten to see a lot of things I'd rather not. As a player I've had death threats directed towards me of many kinds, this is the internet, so I'm not exactly shocked to be honest. There is a sunny side to playing this game however, even as a Marshal, and Plarium has, knowing it or not, provided us an opportunity to play strategically, outside spending money. Sure I speak as a Marshal of a somewhat big league, but I also speak as someone who enjoys the thrill of seeing my plans come to fruition. You'll find yourself deflated sooner or later if you think money is all there is to playing this game and enjoy it while playing.


I want to have fun playing this game and as it stands now I know the means certainly exist. It's just the mentality of "we and them" that gets in the way of potentially making it even more fun as well as money enabling/reinforcing it to some extent.


I don't know why you decided to join the game, but I know why I did and now also why I want to continue playing it. I'm a person like you; I have feelings, fears and make friends whom I don't even know the faces of. So is there a need for all the hard feelings and dislike between us all? I don't think so. We grow as individuals through interaction, whether in a proper direction or not, change comes to us with every meeting, no matter how miniscule. Can't we at least acknowledge each other's resolution to play?

I just don't like to see how there's even a need to aggravate each other over, objectively looking, small matters. I'd rather log out from this game with a good aftertaste, but somehow it's hard with all the strenuous relations.


I'm aware of my verbose nature, I speak too much, but that's because I worry about not being able to convey my thoughts, which is even harder to do on the net considering lack of a personal meeting. Anyway that's my rant and I hope at least someone can start playing with a little bit less stress after having read this.


Thank you for reading as far as you did, even if you didn't finish it all. :)


- DJ Shin

*Plarium isn't a sole entity, just want to make sure you all understand that I know that Plarium is made up of individuals just like us, the community. The difference is our positions.

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Gadheras
9 October, 2016, 8:44 PM UTC

So to reply with a phrase I heard many MANY years ago.


"I don't play this game for you to have fun, but for me to have fun".


You can put into that whatever you like. but end of the day we all different, and there is no right or wrong way in play the game as long as you abide by the game mechancis and rules set in place by Plarium. That being said, there is a lot of asshats out there.
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IronApex Turok
9 October, 2016, 9:35 PM UTC

psychology says that when groups are formed, and one group is told that the other is the enemy, the enemy group is dehuminized in the eyes of the first group.


once you have dehumanized a group, you are more willing to do violence against them. 


the very nature of mmo games puts this effect on the human mind into center stage. 


those folks being mean and nasty to you  simply dont see you as human. 



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sison
10 October, 2016, 1:23 AM UTC

i agree whith you shin many players lose their humanity in the game and this is one of the most sad parts.


and ironapex it is excatly this you said a big problem.


thanks guys for your positions, the forum need posts that focuses on the humanity 
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DJ Friction
10 October, 2016, 4:26 AM UTC

Gadheras said:



So to reply with a phrase I heard many MANY years ago.


"I don't play this game for you to have fun, but for me to have fun".


You can put into that whatever you like. but end of the day we all different, and there is no right or wrong way in play the game as long as you abide by the game mechancis and rules set in place by Plarium. That being said, there is a lot of asshats out there.

No doubt! Probably all of us join the game for the first time with self-interests in focus, I did myself. I was bored and wanted to enjoy something to kill time and this is where I ended up.

Sadly you're right, people are abusing the free reins they're given.


btw, can you multi-quote in this forum? I'm new and haven't learned the ways of it yet.
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DJ Friction
10 October, 2016, 4:28 AM UTC
IronApex Turok said:

psychology says that when groups are formed, and one group is told that the other is the enemy, the enemy group is dehuminized in the eyes of the first group.


once you have dehumanized a group, you are more willing to do violence against them. 


the very nature of mmo games puts this effect on the human mind into center stage. 


those folks being mean and nasty to you  simply dont see you as human. 



Haha, have you seen 'die welle' or 'the wave' in English? It's based on a psychological experiment concerning what you say. It's just sad how even adults are sucked into such a mentality so easily.
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DJ Friction
10 October, 2016, 4:29 AM UTC
sison said:

i agree whith you shin many players lose their humanity in the game and this is one of the most sad parts.


and ironapex it is excatly this you said a big problem.


thanks guys for your positions, the forum need posts that focuses on the humanity 
It's a good idea to gather like-minded people in one place. As one person it's harder to make a difference rather than many in some cases. :)
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Alyona Kolomiitseva
Community Manager
10 October, 2016, 7:46 AM UTC
DJ Shin said:

btw, can you multi-quote in this forum? I'm new and haven't learned the ways of it yet.

No. But I asked our Forum devs to add this feature.
Plarium Community Manager. Please note that I will be unable to respond to your private messages, review your tickets, or check your account information. All technical issues should be directed to our Support Team at plrm.me/Support_Plarium
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Oracle
10 October, 2016, 7:49 AM UTC

in a French publication,  Annales d'Economie et de Statistique, Daniel John Zizzo explores these phenomenon in a very great depth. To cut the story short he discovered in  a study that many would actually dedicate their time and money to see their targets eat dirt—as long as they aren’t found out. 

He explained that people care about their status so much that those in the upper-tier guard it jealously while those at the bottom will do anything to bring them down.

These unfortunately is what Plarium has being outright using to burn us out. To degrade our very human nature, that is the ''human nature'' to spent as much as possible, use whatever means available and not available to win, provided that we won't get caught. These explains why people cheat in the exam, why we steal/stole candies as kids, why I will spend 99$ not to save a rhino but to make sure that Emperor Shin bite dust, and lose in these game. 


Just because something isn't a lie does not mean that it isn't deceptive. A liar knows that he is a liar, but one who speaks mere portions of truth in order to deceive is a craftsman of destruction.....Gedleyihlekisa: Oracle the postremogeniture
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Gadheras
10 October, 2016, 9:22 AM UTC
oracle said:

in a French publication,  Annales d'Economie et de Statistique, Daniel John Zizzo explores these phenomenon in a very great depth. To cut the story short he discovered in  a study that many would actually dedicate their time and money to see their targets eat dirt—as long as they aren’t found out. 

He explained that people care about their status so much that those in the upper-tier guard it jealously while those at the bottom will do anything to bring them down.

These unfortunately is what Plarium has being outright using to burn us out. To degrade our very human nature, that is the ''human nature'' to spent as much as possible, use whatever means available and not available to win, provided that we won't get caught. These explains why people cheat in the exam, why we steal/stole candies as kids, why I will spend 99$ not to save a rhino but to make sure that Emperor Shin bite dust, and lose in these game. 


I think you all crazy for spending that level in this game. got to steam, check how much value you can get for 99 USD....... in comparsion.... now, people spend this over and over and over..... several times? Well, I guess being sane is not a requirement of this game. 
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DJ Friction
10 October, 2016, 3:24 PM UTC
Alyona Kolomiitseva said:

DJ Shin said:

btw, can you multi-quote in this forum? I'm new and haven't learned the ways of it yet.

No. But I asked our Forum devs to add this feature.
Ok thanks. It would be useful to have. :)
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DJ Friction
10 October, 2016, 3:28 PM UTC

oracle said:


in a French publication,  Annales d'Economie et de Statistique, Daniel John Zizzo explores these phenomenon in a very great depth. To cut the story short he discovered in  a study that many would actually dedicate their time and money to see their targets eat dirt—as long as they aren’t found out. 

He explained that people care about their status so much that those in the upper-tier guard it jealously while those at the bottom will do anything to bring them down.

These unfortunately is what Plarium has being outright using to burn us out. To degrade our very human nature, that is the ''human nature'' to spent as much as possible, use whatever means available and not available to win, provided that we won't get caught. These explains why people cheat in the exam, why we steal/stole candies as kids, why I will spend 99$ not to save a rhino but to make sure that Emperor Shin bite dust, and lose in these game. 


That does make a lot of sense. I'll look around if I can't find the article myself as I'm guessing there will be an English version at least. :)


Well! My only wish is that we get rid of the hard feelings between each other. I think that will leave a better aftertaste, but again, it's a tall order.


edit: Found a summary on the guardian's site!

edit2: Oh wow, people are so bad! xD

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Lady Nerium KT-S2
10 October, 2016, 4:07 PM UTC


My many years experience playing these games have shown me that they can bring out the best in people, and unfortunately also the worst in people. Friends you make here count, even if you never meet them face to face, you have still made a connection that can last for years. 


Some people seem to think that it doesn't matter how they behave, because "it's just a game". Not true, in a social sense. For some of the people who play this game, this is their only social interaction due to age or health reasons. We are social animals, and require positive interaction to stay mentally healthy. Having a pleasant conversation with someone can lift your mood. Negative interaction can also affect you, and has caused good players to quit gaming because they can't deal with the constant stress this causes. I have left games before due to poor behavior by other players, so I greatly disagree with people who think what they say or how they behave here doesn't matter because it isn't "real life".


---------------------------


DJ Shin said, 


"I read once that someone complained about this game lacking a 'gentleman spirit' between us as gamers. I agree with that sentiment: Too quickly do we dismiss each other in favour of our league, friends and whatever priorities we have logging in to play the game. We simply forget that this is a game. People focus on spending money to simply beat down on each other and the strategic part of the game is lost. Your meeting with another person is diminished to "My league and everyone else outside of it" and that's a tragedy if anything."


---------------------------


I don't know that DJ Shin went far enough with that idea. The anonymity playing under an assumed name gives us seems to remove all inhibitions in some people. They will say things on chat or PM that they would never dream of saying to someone face to face. Some of the posts I've seen on global chat...lets just say that if someone said that to me in the real world, there'd be a lot of trouble started. 


This is a game and being upset about something that happened here, especially when it is over a legitimate playing tactic, doesn't give anyone the right to forget common courtesy and other's right to also play.  You don't know who the other people are, what their situation is. That player you're blasting in PM about taking your siege... may be someone in the hospital waiting for their chemo to finish, or a 12 year old on school break. What other's say can really hurt, and most times you don't have recourse because the Trolls know exactly how far they can go before crossing the fine line dividing trash talking and harassment. Words can hurt, and I have no respect for people who fall to that level to amuse themselves.


We need to bring more of that "Gentleman (or Lady) Spirit" back into the game. Courtesy between combatants costs nothing, and you might make a new friend. 

I think, therefore I game.
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DJ Friction
10 October, 2016, 5:27 PM UTC

Lady Nerium KT-S2 said:



My many years experience playing these games have shown me that they can bring out the best in people, and unfortunately also the worst in people. Friends you make here count, even if you never meet them face to face, you have still made a connection that can last for years. 


Some people seem to think that it doesn't matter how they behave, because "it's just a game". Not true, in a social sense. For some of the people who play this game, this is their only social interaction due to age or health reasons. We are social animals, and require positive interaction to stay mentally healthy. Having a pleasant conversation with someone can lift your mood. Negative interaction can also affect you, and has caused good players to quit gaming because they can't deal with the constant stress this causes. I have left games before due to poor behavior by other players, so I greatly disagree with people who think what they say or how they behave here doesn't matter because it isn't "real life".




DJ Shin said, 


"I read once that someone complained about this game lacking a 'gentleman spirit' between us as gamers. I agree with that sentiment: Too quickly do we dismiss each other in favour of our league, friends and whatever priorities we have logging in to play the game. We simply forget that this is a game. People focus on spending money to simply beat down on each other and the strategic part of the game is lost. Your meeting with another person is diminished to "My league and everyone else outside of it" and that's a tragedy if anything."


---------------------------


I don't know that DJ Shin went far enough with that idea. The anonymity playing under an assumed name gives us seems to remove all inhibitions in some people. They will say things on chat or PM that they would never dream of saying to someone face to face. Some of the posts I've seen on global chat...lets just say that if someone said that to me in the real world, there'd be a lot of trouble started. 


This is a game and being upset about something that happened here, especially when it is over a legitimate playing tactic, doesn't give anyone the right to forget common courtesy and other's right to also play.  You don't know who the other people are, what their situation is. That player you're blasting in PM about taking your siege... may be someone in the hospital waiting for their chemo to finish, or a 12 year old on school break. What other's say can really hurt, and most times you don't have recourse because the Trolls know exactly how far they can go before crossing the fine line dividing trash talking and harassment. Words can hurt, and I have no respect for people who fall to that level to amuse themselves.


We need to bring more of that "Gentleman (or Lady) Spirit" back into the game. Courtesy between combatants costs nothing, and you might make a new friend. 

Certainly! I have made many friends over the years and I don't know many of their faces. Doesn't bother me! :)


Yes, the sentiment of thinking 'your actions online doesn't have any big consequences, so it wouldn't matter what you do' is a dead sentiment to me. It doesn't make sense to begin with. And as you mention this game may very well be the only meaningful social interaction some get out of their lives, which is why I wish to see at least some change. I'm sorry to hear you've had the experiences you had, never any fun tbh.


Yeah I could go deeper, but knowing my being rather wordy sometimes I try to keep it as concise as I can manage. You don't even want to know how many league letters I edit after having written it all out once. xD Always reaching the limit it seems.

    Yes, the internet persona is usually very different from the one you present irl, sadly, as people would start to notice that they can't just behave like they want without consequences.


That's my point exactly! I wish people would at least be considerate of each other's resolutions/resolve. As you say people don't know about each other's situations, similarly: I had a verbal confrontation with someone who had been targetting one of my members for a long time now, bordering bullying. We talk, I ask if she can't stay away from my member and in all this somehow she starts mentioning that she has had cancer and one eye removed due to it. To me that's a sad thing to have gone through, but with the timing she mentioned it - it seemed as if she wanted to act a victim and use her situation as an excuse to act the way she did - to me that's not acceptable either, so I guess in the end it goes both ways. We don't know each other's situation, so we need to be considerate, but even when we do, that can't be used as an excuse for being mean to another.


Sorry, using colloquial language I've learnt, naturally I include all in my generalisations, women, men and everyone else. :) Believe it or not, I've actually gained two friends from fighting them. All it took was being nice to each other.


Man, I wish I could multi-quote. Feel so talkative having two or three posts in a row. :/

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Oracle
10 October, 2016, 5:38 PM UTC

Lady Nerium KT-S2 said:



Once a man wrote 
'' Courtesy sweetens one's life and make one noble. Like grace and beauty it renders smooth the road of life. A sweet smile, a little courtesy, a little kindness, a little feelings for others practiced all the time will add great charm to ones life and character.''  He further assert the benefits of courtesy, cheerfulness
''Cheerfulness is a joyful frame  frame of the mind. A cheerful man is like a sunny day, he radiates joy and brightness to all. Cheerfulness contribute to good health, it makes the mind peaceful and strengthen the heart...''  remember the man, what he said, every time I see a storm of 100 mil offence coming to knock my altar down. 
'' All harsh and rude speech is Himsa. Harsh word to beggars and servants is Himsa. To wound the feeling of others, by gesture, expression tone of voice and unkind words is Himsa. To slight or show deliberate discourtesy is Wanton HIMSA."
Just because something isn't a lie does not mean that it isn't deceptive. A liar knows that he is a liar, but one who speaks mere portions of truth in order to deceive is a craftsman of destruction.....Gedleyihlekisa: Oracle the postremogeniture
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DJ Friction
10 October, 2016, 7:43 PM UTC
oracle said:

Lady Nerium KT-S2 said:



Once a man wrote 
'' Courtesy sweetens one's life and make one noble. Like grace and beauty it renders smooth the road of life. A sweet smile, a little courtesy, a little kindness, a little feelings for others practiced all the time will add great charm to ones life and character.''  He further assert the benefits of courtesy, cheerfulness
''Cheerfulness is a joyful frame  frame of the mind. A cheerful man is like a sunny day, he radiates joy and brightness to all. Cheerfulness contribute to good health, it makes the mind peaceful and strengthen the heart...''  remember the man, what he said, every time I see a storm of 100 mil offence coming to knock my altar down. 
'' All harsh and rude speech is Himsa. Harsh word to beggars and servants is Himsa. To wound the feeling of others, by gesture, expression tone of voice and unkind words is Himsa. To slight or show deliberate discourtesy is Wanton HIMSA."
Can I safely assume that Himsa means violence from the google search? Makes sense that way.
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djmoody
13 October, 2016, 3:44 PM UTC

Alyona Kolomiitseva said:


DJ Shin said:

btw, can you multi-quote in this forum? I'm new and haven't learned the ways of it yet.

No. But I asked our Forum devs to add this feature.

WRONG!!!!


Its incredibily easy if you just invest 5 minutes in understanding BBC code that is used to mark up text in most forums

if you put  <blockquote></blockquote> tags around text it becomes a quote.

you see this is a quote now because I added the tags. Just make sure you press the <> "view html" button then add the tags

Here's some more examples:

DJ Shin said:

I am pretty lame for not being able to express my own opinion on my own account. Instead I used an alt ripping of 2 senior figures in the game's names.
Everyone has a right to an opinion. No one has a right to their opinion being respected by other if it can't be backed up with rational and logic explanation
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Sculptor
13 October, 2016, 10:06 PM UTC

Well I haven't had that much of death threats, so maybe I'm not playing the game right .


But what do you expect from a war game, the basics of the game is to fight eachother. A lot of people in the world have frustration and anger inside of them but they can't release it because you have to behave in the real world so they come online. And what a better thing then to play a war game where you can kick someones butt. And that a bunch of people go to far isn't wanted or needed of course but I can understand. And I'd rather see them doing it here then in Real Life to be honest. If you really don't want any agression then farm ville (if that's still popular??) should be a good alternative.


And 10s of 1000s of years has shown us that there is allways a war fought on this planet. Between tribes, between countries, between races, between neighbours etc.  You can say it's human nature to fight. And a war never starts with the kind words.

But please don't see mee as one of them though!!!

Allthough I did one time get a warning for using the word 'stupid'. Someone attacked an ally and I sent a letter telling them they did a stupid thing. And I got a warning for that??? Really plarium, if you don't read the letter and don't know the context then don't sent warnings because I think that's stupid to.
Member of Blue Magic
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Lady Nerium KT-S2
14 October, 2016, 12:58 AM UTC

Sculpter said:


"But what do you expect from a war game, the basics of the game is to fight each other. A lot of people in the world have frustration and anger inside of them but they can't release it because you have to behave in the real world so they come online. And what a better thing then to play a war game where you can kick someones butt. And that a bunch of people go to far isn't wanted or needed of course but I can understand. And I'd rather see them doing it here then in Real Life to be honest. If you really don't want any agression then farm ville (if that's still popular??) should be a good alternative."


There's a difference between playing an aggressive game on Stormfall, and totally wiping someone out, and taking your frustration out on someone who has no connection to your anger on chat or in an email.  As you said, this isn't Farmville - this is a war game, and you will not win every fight!  You win by playing better than someone else a majority of the time - you lose by losing your temper and treating someone else in a degrading or insulting manner.  

Get excited, do a happy dance as your enemy's castle smokes, brag a bit about the kill ratio... but be an adult about it and keep it civil.



I think, therefore I game.
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BiohazarD
Moderator
14 October, 2016, 2:43 AM UTC

Lady Nerium KT-S2 said:


Sculpter said:


"But what do you expect from a war game, the basics of the game is to fight each other. A lot of people in the world have frustration and anger inside of them but they can't release it because you have to behave in the real world so they come online. And what a better thing then to play a war game where you can kick someones butt. And that a bunch of people go to far isn't wanted or needed of course but I can understand. And I'd rather see them doing it here then in Real Life to be honest. If you really don't want any agression then farm ville (if that's still popular??) should be a good alternative."


There's a difference between playing an aggressive game on Stormfall, and totally wiping someone out, and taking your frustration out on someone who has no connection to your anger on chat or in an email.  As you said, this isn't Farmville - this is a war game, and you will not win every fight!  You win by playing better than someone else a majority of the time - you lose by losing your temper and treating someone else in a degrading or insulting manner.  

Get excited, do a happy dance as your enemy's castle smokes, brag a bit about the kill ratio... but be an adult about it and keep it civil.



Well most of the time you just win by buying more troops than the other guy...

crazy money > strategy
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