New Feature: Prize Draws!

94 Replies
Gadheras
13 December, 2016, 3:07 PM UTC

Eugenia Misura said:


Gadheras said:


Just want to add....


For Alyona to lock a bunch of threads and gather the discussion into ONE thread, and then the new admin close that one as well with the conclusion of "because we say so its legal.", doesn't make it so.


If Plarium have any reference to law and rule that state this is no clear case of gambling. Please supply it.

The topic was closed because we gave several irrefragable answers regarding this matter.

Well acording to the laws here in Norway regarding lottery and gambling, its not. I can supply you links to the the relevant laws in question if you want? And others on the forums here have been refering to laws in their own countries as well. The issue never been about the prize have an actual montetary value that can be sold of etc for rl cash, the issue been the entry ticket that can be.


I gave an example, how a dispute over a charge back could unfold, and Im certain the terms gambling would surface.


If Plarium can actually show towards actual law within like EU, that this isn't gambling, I would love for you to do so.



UTC +2:00
Alina Bright
Community Manager
14 December, 2016, 9:42 AM UTC

Lords and Ladies, as was mentioned in all our previous responses, the Prize Draw is not to be considered any type of gambling. If you have any doubts or don't like this feature, you can continue playing the game without participating in Draws. It's up to you. Each player should decide which aspects of the game make his gaming experience comfortable and positive.

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IronApex Turok
14 December, 2016, 2:54 PM UTC

Eugenia Misura said:


Lords and Ladies, as was menationed in all our previous responses, the Prize Draw is not to be considered any type of gambling. If you have any doubts or don't like this feature, you can continue playing the game without participating in Draws. It's up to you. Each player should decide which aspects of the game make his gaming experience comfortable and positive.

telling us that crack isnt to be considered a drug doesnt it make it not a drug.



you can claim all you want, but the laws of many countries make this illegal. 
UTC +0:00
ThatGuy
16 December, 2016, 8:31 PM UTC

Alyona Kolomiitseva said:


FlyinTiger said:


No they don't.....  If I can only afford to buy one in the Express, that's a 1:100.  Whereas someone who buys 10... that's a 1:10.  Who do the odds favor now, Professor?
Each invested ticket has the same chances to be chosen a winning one. Some players may invest more tickets to increase their chances, but it doesn't mean that your chance of winning becomes less. It stays the same.

Each ticket has an equal chance to win.  In that sense, all players who participate have an equal chance to win.  

However, players are allowed to buy more than one ticket.  While each ticket has the same chance of winning, a player who holds 10 tickets has a greater chance of holding a winning ticket than a player who holds just one ticket.  Can that one ticket win?  Yes.  Is it more likely for the person holding 10 tickets to win?  Yes.  If someone else bought up all the remaining 89 tickets, would they have a better chance of holding a winning ticket than the guy who has 10?  Yes.  

UTC +6:00
ThatGuy
16 December, 2016, 8:43 PM UTC
Snowgoon said:

Lord Oberon said:


New Feature: Prize Draws!


The more Tickets you enter, the better your chances of winning a Reward!

I wonder how long it will be before the bots start buying tickets.

There are enough of them to guarantee winning every prize draw.

Better not roll this out on the Pirate game or the Russian bot owners will drain you dry. RUaL league will take everything you offer them
Plarium rakes in more sapphires than they give out from this event.  They would not get any real money from it, but they also would lose nothing but digital assets it costs them very little to generate.
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ThatGuy
16 December, 2016, 9:20 PM UTC

Juglar del Viento said:


Dear Lords

i wonder how many of u plays another game in which you have to spin the roulette once at day and you win a boost. and i wonder how many can use that game currency to spin an extra round. and i wonder how many of you are considering that thas spinning roulette consider it gambling and if its illegal or not

and yep im sure that game is played by very younger people.

please be serious most of we are combing white hear long years ago.

Regards and enjoy


To be honest, none of the other games I play have a system like that.  There are luck based mechanics for free in game items and VIP (or equivalent) get an extra chance automatically.  In the state I live in, that is just barely legal since the money spent for VIP is not being spent specifically to gamble, but instead for a package of extra perks.  

I have seen lots of pay to win games with gambling mechanics, but none with a straight up raffle or roulette wheel.  All the ones I've seen, you are buying actual in game items.  Some of those items are chests that you can open and have a chance of obtaining really good items, but you always get something, even if that something is not useful to your character (loot boxes in Overwatch, for example).

UTC +6:00
ThatGuy
16 December, 2016, 9:30 PM UTC

Jezebel said:


lol saph spending is obviously on the decline so you had to come up with some other way to get people to buy saphs and spend real money, you have reduced discounts further so you must find another way to make up the difference.


no more 50% discounts now they are 30% so I bet that really affected the spending, personally I like it, fewer fireballs in the game 

 I think its based on how often you buy. I don't buy very often and find I'm almost always offered 80% discount.  I find when I've just bought, if I check the next batch of offers, its dropped to 60%, but several months later, when I'm ready to buy again, its at 80%. If those sweet discounts are slowly going away, it'll take me quite a while to notice.

 I thought that was why so many fireballs come from lower level castles, often under the pink, returned player bubbles.  They are possibly alts or less active players who are getting sweet deals on sapphires compared to what those who spend regularly are asked to pay.

UTC +6:00
ThatGuy
16 December, 2016, 9:41 PM UTC

IronApex Turok said:


Juglar del Viento said:


Gadheras said:

I had great fun play red dead redemption and play cards, I had fun play The Wticher and play gwent... and so forth. difference is... I had no option to use my credit card to pay for chips and tickets.


you have many ways to get sapphires in game without using credit card so please be serious my thought is that all this is only for the pleasure of arguing.

Regards
but like my lawyer said... you cant control which sapphires are free and which ones are real life money. so in the eyes of the law, its all real life money and gambling. 

Wartune gets around that problem with balen and bound balen.  You earn bound balen in game through in game activities.  You buy balen.  There are technically no non cash ways to obtain balen, but some platforms offer you ways to earn their currency for "free" and that can be used to buy balen.  There are gamble mechanics, but they are gambles for items, not for in game currency.  You cannot win balen or bound balen in any event nor can you convert any items you obtain to balen/bound balen or real money.  

Note:  Wartune is very much pay to win and and has massive cash grabs  Also, it is hosted by R2, which has a very bad reputation and customer service that makes Plarium's look good by comparison.  The only reason I bring it up here is to point out what they do to avoid losing player to state laws calling their gamble mechanics illegal.
UTC +6:00
ThatGuy
16 December, 2016, 9:46 PM UTC
Alyona Kolomiitseva said:

IronApex Turok said:


but like my lawyer said... you cant control which sapphires are free and which ones are real life money. so in the eyes of the law, its all real life money and gambling. 
f you still have any doubts or don't like it for some reason, you can continue playing the game without participating in Draws. It's up to you. We have implemented it to diversify gameplay experience and give players another entertainment in our game, along with a chance of winning big rewards. However, each player should decide which aspects of the game make his gaming experience comfortable and positive. 
Can Plarium find a way to differentiate prize winnings sapphires from regular sapphires?  Just change the name, give them a separate counter and a log to document how many have been earned/used.  There's no reason to resrict how they can be used, just give players that need it a means to demonstrate that they did not gamble in the game.  That sounds like it would resolve the legal issue for IronApex  Turok since he could prove that none of his sapphires are from the raffle.  
UTC +6:00
jumy
17 December, 2016, 12:16 AM UTC

ThatGuy said:


Alyona Kolomiitseva said:


IronApex Turok said:



but like my lawyer said... you cant control which sapphires are free and which ones are real life money. so in the eyes of the law, its all real life money and gambling. 
f you still have any doubts or don't like it for some reason, you can continue playing the game without participating in Draws. It's up to you. We have implemented it to diversify gameplay experience and give players another entertainment in our game, along with a chance of winning big rewards. However, each player should decide which aspects of the game make his gaming experience comfortable and positive. 
Can Plarium find a way to differentiate prize winnings sapphires from regular sapphires?  Just change the name, give them a separate counter and a log to document how many have been earned/used.  There's no reason to resrict how they can be used, just give players that need it a means to demonstrate that they did not gamble in the game.  That sounds like it would resolve the legal issue for IronApex  Turok since he could prove that none of his sapphires are from the raffle.  

Plarium need only this


YOUR MONEY

The truth hurts
UTC +12:00
Gadheras
17 December, 2016, 12:15 PM UTC

ThatGuy said:


Alyona Kolomiitseva said:


IronApex Turok said:



but like my lawyer said... you cant control which sapphires are free and which ones are real life money. so in the eyes of the law, its all real life money and gambling. 
f you still have any doubts or don't like it for some reason, you can continue playing the game without participating in Draws. It's up to you. We have implemented it to diversify gameplay experience and give players another entertainment in our game, along with a chance of winning big rewards. However, each player should decide which aspects of the game make his gaming experience comfortable and positive. 
Can Plarium find a way to differentiate prize winnings sapphires from regular sapphires?  Just change the name, give them a separate counter and a log to document how many have been earned/used.  There's no reason to resrict how they can be used, just give players that need it a means to demonstrate that they did not gamble in the game.  That sounds like it would resolve the legal issue for IronApex  Turok since he could prove that none of his sapphires are from the raffle.  

They would need to have a ingame currency you can buy tickets for that can't be traced to rl cash. But if they do that, then the point of the "lottery" is moth because they can't make money of it the way they do now. The only reason it exist is because "spend money > sapphires > tickets", and if you leave out the first step, well you know....



UTC +2:00
jumy
17 December, 2016, 2:54 PM UTC

Gadheras said:



They would need to have a ingame currency you can buy tickets for that can't be traced to rl cash. But if they do that, then the point of the "lottery" is moth because they can't make money of it the way they do now. The only reason it exist is because "spend money > sapphires > tickets", and if you leave out the first step, well you know....



What gains plarium if so?  will must provide fun in this game?

The truth hurts
UTC +12:00
BeastMaster
18 December, 2016, 7:08 AM UTC

Not cool

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Angel DC
27 June, 2017, 10:15 PM UTC
I entered and won but never recieved the prize
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brunsonthomas
28 June, 2017, 11:40 PM UTC

Submit a ticket with the date and which prize you were supposed to win to https://plariumsupport.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/requests/new

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