I have the same problem and only go to Arena for my Daily Challange. My TEAM is at 82K and if I try to battle a team with 53K it should not be a problem, BUT I go in and have my entire team wiped out before I can do anything. Something is very wrong here.
Team power is indeed not everything (I routinely beat teams more powerful than mine), but it would be a better, fairer starting point than account power, especially in Bronze I where new players come to have their first Arena experience. And it's silly for some dude hanging out in Gold with a score of Legos to suggest they ought to first max their starter (or most powerful champ) and then it'd be easy -- the game's missions and challenges ask you to participate in Arena much sooner. It's ridiculous that newcomers have to deal with refreshing Arena for hours just to get 5 wins with their 4-40 teams (6 if you want to get 2 clan stars, 12 if you want 3). Sure, for the Daily Quest you just have to fight, not to win, but if you actually want to do your Great Hall quests and the "win N Classic Arena fight" ones, you have to win. Don't even get me started on how stupidly expensive the Great Hall is. Besides, it's depressing to always lose. Games are supposed to be fun.
Ideally what I want to see on each Arena list is a third team power roughly equal to mine, a third up to 40% more, and a third up to 40% less. A speedier, less powerful team can still win, as can a slower, tankier one, and the occasional early player does pull a nice Epic or Legendary which gives them more power than the Starter-Sniper-Warpriest-Crusader combo, but overall it'd be more equitable, especially at the start when people haven't learned all the tricks yet. Everybody should have a relatively accessible chance to get some wins because they're matched against relatively comparable teams. Bronze Arena should not be as frustrating as it is now, especially not the first 2 tiers. It's a failure of game design that it is; all the knowledgeable advice here notwithstanding -- that's just work-around because the design is bad. It's ludicrous that one would have to limit one's number of champions in a champion collection game! For me most of the fun lies in exploring what different champs can do and where they might fit. No way will I crunch a single one to lower my Arena rating.
The game, frankly, doesn't reward players enough with quality gameplay for them to have to research Arena workings in-depth so early on. Few of my co-starters are still here; most left when it became clear this is nothing but an super-grindy excuse for frustrating you into spending money, and if you don't spend a lot, the company doesn't care about you.
Team power is indeed not everything (I routinely beat teams more powerful than mine), but it would be a better, fairer starting point than account power, especially in Bronze I where new players come to have their first Arena experience. And it's silly for some dude hanging out in Gold with a score of Legos to suggest they ought to first max their starter (or most powerful champ) and then it'd be easy -- the game's missions and challenges ask you to participate in Arena much sooner. It's ridiculous that newcomers have to deal with refreshing Arena for hours just to get 5 wins with their 4-40 teams (6 if you want to get 2 clan stars, 12 if you want 3). Sure, for the Daily Quest you just have to fight, not to win, but if you actually want to do your Great Hall quests and the "win N Classic Arena fight" ones, you have to win. Don't even get me started on how stupidly expensive the Great Hall is. Besides, it's depressing to always lose. Games are supposed to be fun.
Ideally what I want to see on each Arena list is a third team power roughly equal to mine, a third up to 40% more, and a third up to 40% less. A speedier, less powerful team can still win, as can a slower, tankier one, and the occasional early player does pull a nice Epic or Legendary which gives them more power than the Starter-Sniper-Warpriest-Crusader combo, but overall it'd be more equitable, especially at the start when people haven't learned all the tricks yet. Everybody should have a relatively accessible chance to get some wins because they're matched against relatively comparable teams. Bronze Arena should not be as frustrating as it is now, especially not the first 2 tiers. It's a failure of game design that it is; all the knowledgeable advice here notwithstanding -- that's just work-around because the design is bad. It's ludicrous that one would have to limit one's number of champions in a champion collection game! For me most of the fun lies in exploring what different champs can do and where they might fit. No way will I crunch a single one to lower my Arena rating.
The game, frankly, doesn't reward players enough with quality gameplay for them to have to research Arena workings in-depth so early on. Few of my co-starters are still here; most left when it became clear this is nothing but an super-grindy excuse for frustrating you into spending money, and if you don't spend a lot, the company doesn't care about you.
He said it all, I have nothing to add.
Edit: I will add something: just had a battle with my team - two lvl 60 rares, two lvl 50 epics with the best gear I have at this time. Enemy team: 1 epic lvl 60 champinon. Team power: roughly the same, around 60K. My first moving ch Diabolist has speed of 193. My team never got a chance, one time hit, all dead.
My point: not questioning weather enemy ch should be able to do it - let him if he's so good. BUT: WTF is he doing in my level arena?
AND: champions should be the winners, not their gear
I had the same issues early on. Bronze was a nightmare. I finally hit Silver 1 week and then dropped back down to Bronze and stayed there for a couple of months. Then 1 weekend I had some arena tokens saved in my inbox and blitzed all weekend and went from Bronze 4 to Gold 4, with the same team setup, and have stayed in Gold 4 ever since. I blew up a lot of gems that weekend refreshing the lineup of teams in the qeue, but I did make it.
What I have an issue with is getting penalized for a loss and NOT getting rewarded for a win. If you win you get 7-8 points, and if you lose you get penalized 12-13 points. Plarium needs to start rewarding the WINS more than penalising the losses.
What I have an issue with is getting penalized for a loss and NOT getting rewarded for a win. If you win you get 7-8 points, and if you lose you get penalized 12-13 points. Plarium needs to start rewarding the WINS more than penalising the losses.
That depends on rating. You gain and lose points depending on how far below/above you the other person is in rating. E.g. I just lost a battle against an enemy that had a significantly higher rating, a win would've gotten me 14 points, so the loss gave me, as expected, minus 6 points. But if I had attacked somebody with a much lower rating than me, it would've been the other way around: only 6 points for a win, but minus 14 for a loss. The total is always 20 - so if you hit someone who has a rating very close to yours, then it's the same number, 10 points for a win or minus 10 for a loss.
I had the same issues early on. Bronze was a nightmare. I finally hit Silver 1 week and then dropped back down to Bronze and stayed there for a couple of months. Then 1 weekend I had some arena tokens saved in my inbox and blitzed all weekend and went from Bronze 4 to Gold 4, with the same team setup, and have stayed in Gold 4 ever since. I blew up a lot of gems that weekend refreshing the lineup of teams in the qeue, but I did make it.
I had the same. but you can't keep that up for long. After the end of an arena match. You will be thrown back all at once. I have also held it in gold for a while. But couldn't hold it anymore. Also, don't forget that the person with a 60 rank chamions also gets a higher bonus. more HP, Def Citcal Damage etc. So these people higher in rank champion have also an advantage.
You can't complete quests like that .
all opponents have allmost 60 levels of champions . I'have 2, 60 rank chamions and 2 Legends.
Tag Team arena, is also out of balance just like classic arena .
All these theories on matchmaking being determined by player power are new to me... I'm pretty sceptical, but then I haven't been in bronze in ages, for all I know it could be true. But even if it does provide you a short-term arena boost (only short-term because once you have a decent full-60 team, you can climb out of bronze and it won't matter much anymore), scrapping champions like that sounds pretty wasteful to me.
I am very, very confident. Deleted a ton of random rares I had leveled and used in faction wars and climbed from Bronze II to Silver I in a couple of weeks. I faced easier opponents with lower team power levels in Silver I than what I had been facing in Bronze II. (Power level dropped from about 450k to about 300k just by getting rid of random champs)
I have only seen this post right now.
I just got done reading everything everyone has said.
Some of the things people have said are good.
Some of the things people have said are bad.
The reason the OP isn't doing good in Arena is very simple.
He didn't follow Tofu comment 3 days ago.
Tofu said the following statement:
You got fairly good champions for arena [High khatun (40) Warmaiden (40) Galek (50) and Miscreated Monster (60)]. Generally, your problems could be the following:
The OP has done step 1 -----> Check
The Team he is running is a good composition.
The Speed lead he is using is High Khatun.
The OP has done step 2 ------> Check
The OP has speed on his High Khatun based on what he is saying.
The OP knows the right turn order.
The OP hasn't done step 3 -----> Nope
The OP Damage dealer (Galek) is level 50.
The OP Debuffer (Warmaiden) is level 40.
You want your Damage Dealer level 60 maxed so you can deliver the maximum damage to enemy team.
A level 50 Galek isn't killing anyone really.
You want your Debuffer level 60 + ascended because it allows you to put banners on your champion.
An Accuracy Banner on Warmaiden can be huge to help ensure you land her Def Down.
The OP has done step 4 -----> Check
The OP is a beginner in Bronze Tier with bad gear.
The people he is fighting against are beginners in Bronze Tier with bad gear too.
It cancels out - So he is fine for now
The OP hasn't done step 5 -----> Nope
The OP has admitted to not having full masteries on his Galek.
Galek is the one who is suppose to kill the enemy.
If Galek isn't fully done, Than your not going to fully kill the enemy.
The enemy is just going to turn around and spank you.
The Arena set up you have is a Glass Cannon Speed Nuking set up.
It is kill or be killed.
You destroy the enemey in 1 hit
or the Enemy will destroy you in 1 hit.
The OP hasn't told us about step 6 -----> Unclear
The OP damage dealer is Magic Affinity.
Magic Affinity heroes are weak vs. Force Affinity heroes.
You want to avoid heavy Force Affinity teams in Arena as they will give you the biggest chance of losing.
The reason you are having trouble is because you are lacking Step 3, Step 5, & potientally Step 6
Improve these things and you will win.
A few things:
step 3: I do have Galek 60 now (which helped) but MM is actually a huge nuker, too. He was dealing more damage than Galek, and still is pretty close (and much tankier, better utility). So I have 2 nukers, before they were 50/60, now they're 60/60
Warmaiden hits her debuff 90%+ of the time. It's very rare I lose a match because it doesn't hit. I'd say maybe about 1/20 losses could be because of that
step 5: Of course I want full masteries. But do you think you should need full masteries and 2 level 60s to get out of bronze II?
Step 6: Through trial and error, I learned which force champs (and other random champs) to avoid.
Where you are wrong: Step 4: in bronze tier, enemies are NOT beginners with bad gear. In bronze II, there are full level 60 teams with top tier epic/legendaries and team power ratings well over 100. They need to fix the matchmaking algorithm; if you're facing people 10x as strong in gold (even silver?) who cares. In bronze, it's senseless gatekeeping because the devs can't come up with (or are too lazy to implement) a matchmaking system that works. I can think of three off the top of my head in fewer than 3 minutes:
1) No weighting based on acct power level; small inflationary system: strong players move up, weaker players stay down. Eventually, ranks sort themselves out and you're facing people of similar power levels
2) Matchmaking is based on power level of a certain number of strongest heroes per acct. Could be the 4 (10? 20?) strongest heroes, with a floor for power level (to prevent "smurfing"). You still encounter enemies that scale based on your power level, but it's a closer representation of "true" power than looking at 50 2-star foods sitting in your roster
3) Matchmaking is based on the average power level of your arena offense team in the last 20 (50? 100?) matches. Same as 2.
The fact is: they don't know, they don't care, or they don't know how to fix it. Any of the three is a problem. I guess I'll just get past whatever threshold and grind out silver, but it's such a bad, flawed system and will surely turn tons of new players away from the game. ESPECIALLY because the arena missions are so misplaced (i.e. on the arbiter path). E.g. reach silver II in classic arena comes after 3 star on hard difficulty. I have brutal 3 starred on all stages and most of nightmare done and JUST hit silver I. It's a joke.
So.. If you see 4 champions in bronze 1, max level and fully acended means that is no longer fair?
What if the player just ignore arena and missions, and just keep on leveling champions?
I know there is, because I am one of them. I ignore all missions when I started. Just do what I can do. I only focus in missions when I was like able to get 6 star artifacts from dragon.
No need to rush there is no time limit on the missions.
And as of power levels, dont get fooled on higher power level than yours.
Let us say you only have 40k team power. And you are matched with a 70k+ team power. It does not mean you are already have no chance of winning. Your opponent might have just like bunch of these. Higher teampower than yours but have almost no stats at all.
I understand, that wasn't really my point. I kill dudes with higher power ratings/higher level champs but it's a risk every single time. Meaning I win maybe 50%, probably less, which means my rank goes down.
I understand there's no time limit on missions... BUT the rewards you get from it are so useful for progression, having them gatekept behind arena feels like trash. What if instead of getting daily rewards they gave you ALL your daily login rewards when you logged in on the 30th day. "No rush" -- but wouldn't it be nice to just get them on a regular basis?
Team power is indeed not everything (I routinely beat teams more powerful than mine), but it would be a better, fairer starting point than account power, especially in Bronze I where new players come to have their first Arena experience. And it's silly for some dude hanging out in Gold with a score of Legos to suggest they ought to first max their starter (or most powerful champ) and then it'd be easy -- the game's missions and challenges ask you to participate in Arena much sooner. It's ridiculous that newcomers have to deal with refreshing Arena for hours just to get 5 wins with their 4-40 teams (6 if you want to get 2 clan stars, 12 if you want 3). Sure, for the Daily Quest you just have to fight, not to win, but if you actually want to do your Great Hall quests and the "win N Classic Arena fight" ones, you have to win. Don't even get me started on how stupidly expensive the Great Hall is. Besides, it's depressing to always lose. Games are supposed to be fun.
Ideally what I want to see on each Arena list is a third team power roughly equal to mine, a third up to 40% more, and a third up to 40% less. A speedier, less powerful team can still win, as can a slower, tankier one, and the occasional early player does pull a nice Epic or Legendary which gives them more power than the Starter-Sniper-Warpriest-Crusader combo, but overall it'd be more equitable, especially at the start when people haven't learned all the tricks yet. Everybody should have a relatively accessible chance to get some wins because they're matched against relatively comparable teams. Bronze Arena should not be as frustrating as it is now, especially not the first 2 tiers. It's a failure of game design that it is; all the knowledgeable advice here notwithstanding -- that's just work-around because the design is bad. It's ludicrous that one would have to limit one's number of champions in a champion collection game! For me most of the fun lies in exploring what different champs can do and where they might fit. No way will I crunch a single one to lower my Arena rating.
The game, frankly, doesn't reward players enough with quality gameplay for them to have to research Arena workings in-depth so early on. Few of my co-starters are still here; most left when it became clear this is nothing but an super-grindy excuse for frustrating you into spending money, and if you don't spend a lot, the company doesn't care about you.
100% agree with what you said
The fact you can't get out of Bronze 1 means your doing something wrong.
Post Screenshots of your 4 Arena Champion's on this thread.
I want to see the gear + stats you have on them.
Seems to me like matchmaking is based entirely on account power. That's the only thing that seems even remotely even in my matchups. I've been keeping a bunch of 3-stars in my vault in the hopes that they can eventually be used for faction crypts, but they are essentially useless for any practical purposes since they can't even beat the first level. I've also noticed that ever since I started building up a team of spares, my arena battles have been getting simply brutal, facing teams 1.5-2x stronger (and I've seen higher than that) with a solid wall of purple and gold level 60s (I've got 1 rare at 60, and only the 2 free epics). I'm tempted to get rid of them just to see what happens, but then I might as well give up all hopes of the crypts. I shouldn't have to though, and if that's what I have to do to get arena battles against people with teams around my level even at the lowest tier, that's just absurd.
Seems to me like matchmaking is based entirely on account power. That's the only thing that seems even remotely even in my matchups. I've been keeping a bunch of 3-stars in my vault in the hopes that they can eventually be used for faction crypts, but they are essentially useless for any practical purposes since they can't even beat the first level. I've also noticed that ever since I started building up a team of spares, my arena battles have been getting simply brutal, facing teams 1.5-2x stronger (and I've seen higher than that) with a solid wall of purple and gold level 60s (I've got 1 rare at 60, and only the 2 free epics). I'm tempted to get rid of them just to see what happens, but then I might as well give up all hopes of the crypts. I shouldn't have to though, and if that's what I have to do to get arena battles against people with teams around my level even at the lowest tier, that's just absurd.
Yeah ive started to notice this you are being punished for lvling heros to 30 for FW. There is a guy in my arena list right now with Krisk Ithos and Black Knight who has a lower Player power then me someone with 0 leggos and a bunch of useless epics. Dont base any part of the matchmaking on player power for the love of god.
The fact you can't get out of Bronze 1 means your doing something wrong.
Post Screenshots of your 4 Arena Champion's on this thread.
I want to see the gear + stats you have on them.
I already said I've made it to silver (silver II for a bit). Same problems as in bronze, but even more so -- every time I open a bunch of random shards to level food, my player power rating goes up 50k and I start facing teams of fully kitted out level 60 premium legendaries/epics with masteries, have to refresh 10 times to find a team worth fighting. Delete a bunch of champions, I can jump from bronze IV to silver II in a couple of refreshes.
The matchmaking algorithm (at least in bronze and low silver) is just bad beyond belief. I don't know if it's people who quit and dropped from gold to silver/bronze or what. For what it's worth, when I have low player power rating, I face weaker teams in silver II than what I saw at bronze III when I had a bunch of random 1/2 star dudes just sitting around. It's just such a waste of time to refresh and find no one even remotely worth fighting 9/10 times I refresh.
Seems to me like matchmaking is based entirely on account power. That's the only thing that seems even remotely even in my matchups. I've been keeping a bunch of 3-stars in my vault in the hopes that they can eventually be used for faction crypts, but they are essentially useless for any practical purposes since they can't even beat the first level. I've also noticed that ever since I started building up a team of spares, my arena battles have been getting simply brutal, facing teams 1.5-2x stronger (and I've seen higher than that) with a solid wall of purple and gold level 60s (I've got 1 rare at 60, and only the 2 free epics). I'm tempted to get rid of them just to see what happens, but then I might as well give up all hopes of the crypts. I shouldn't have to though, and if that's what I have to do to get arena battles against people with teams around my level even at the lowest tier, that's just absurd.
This was exactly my experience. I started a fresh account and have just deleted every single rare except warmaiden, spirit host and a second nuker; I managed to get to the same arena rating with a 60-40-40-30 team of all rares (in two weeks) as my older account with 3x60s and a 50, 2 rares and 2 epics and MUCH stronger gear (after two months).
My advice to you: delete every single rare unless it's a really strong one or used in a fusion (look for guides as to which rares are worth keeping). You probably want to keep epics for later use. DO NOT LEVEL OR GEAR any guy that you're not actively using. They contribute to your player power, so keep them as weak as possible. Just stick them in the vault and forget about them until you need them. Also, only open shards when you need new food to level/rank up your main guys. Having 10 level 1's unequipped in your bank increases your player power more than ranking your main dude up from 5 to 6 stars and leveling from 50 to 60 (great system btw!)
Faction wars aren't worth progressing until you have super beefed out teams anyway. You should be able to get to the level 6 with your starter and other guys on your arena team, farm those out for speed runes and the rest just say oh well.
That is literally the best way to progress in arena (at least early on.) Gimp your account, miss out on advanced missions, and skip content. Or just uninstall the game, I don't think the devs actually care about balance/experience outside of pandering to the whales
I managed to claw my way, tooth and nail, to S1 with a team that really shouldn't be competitive (Athel, Spirit Host, Courtier and Shaman) due to low levels of synergy and frankly pretty crap gear, and my experience so far is that it's significantly easier than B4. I was stuck just below silver for days, at one point at 1299 points, only getting a matchup even worth considering every 5 draws. Got to silver, won 3 matches instantly. Now I get a decent matchup every other draw, sometimes multiple. Got my 30 silver wins to advance the mission even, now I'm considering just dropping down to B3 or something and hope for medals since I'm nowhere close to having use for silver medals anyway (even with the 24 + 10 + 5 arena tokens per day, 100% win rate and B3-4 for 2 tokens per win, that's still a full week to get a single upgrade to level 3).
Between that, and the fact that the arena very much discourages experimenting against different lineups even if you're not really confident you can win, kinda kills the fun in it for me. I very much like the concept of being able to try strategies against different teams, but instead I find myself just rerolling over and over because most teams I face are just so much stronger that it doesn't really matter what I do, and I get punished for losing if I try it anyway.
I already said I've made it to silver (silver II for a bit). Same problems as in bronze, but even more so -- every time I open a bunch of random shards to level food, my player power rating goes up 50k and I start facing teams of fully kitted out level 60 premium legendaries/epics with masteries, have to refresh 10 times to find a team worth fighting. Delete a bunch of champions, I can jump from bronze IV to silver II in a couple of refreshes.
The matchmaking algorithm (at least in bronze and low silver) is just bad beyond belief. I don't know if it's people who quit and dropped from gold to silver/bronze or what. For what it's worth, when I have low player power rating, I face weaker teams in silver II than what I saw at bronze III when I had a bunch of random 1/2 star dudes just sitting around. It's just such a waste of time to refresh and find no one even remotely worth fighting 9/10 times I refresh.
I have now also been reset from gold to silver 2. And can't get any higher. It's gotten worse and worse here.
Agree its broken.
I'm running a lvl60 Kael, fully ascended and maxes masteries. Once frostbring buffs attack 30% and warmaiden drops defense, Kael hits and kills enemy teams within about 30% of my power level about 1/5 times.
Followup attach is Jinglehunter's are, he's my speed lead to get me in front of the high katun led teams.
I'm still encountering teams in bronze 3/4 with all lvl 60s and 2-3 leggos in about 75% of my matches.
I havent made it to silver yet at end of month 2, F2P.
Once I make it to silver my next progression mission is campaign hard... I've already 3* brutal! Lol.
Progression missions are completely put of touch with the reality of early arena.
But hey, Plarium wants to present me with problems that $29.99 could solve, thats the business model.
Arena is crazy unless your lucky enough to be in gold the bots in silver are discustinly difficult i sat in silver four for over 3 months slowly losing ground. Now i relize i cant make it to gold so I give up and purposely keep losing boom silver 3 boom silver 2 boom silver 1 and guess what the bots are the same. Time for an experiment I say to myself so i again keep loosing every match up and start tumbling down the bronze ladder now boom bronze 4 ,3 ,2 ,1 cant get any lower now and geuss what its still ridiculous. So thanks to all the Whales who wanted an arena fix you got it but it has come at silver and bronzes expense
this is bronze 1 have fun new guys so Flatdude my friend i know where your coming from
